July 21st 2008
Is KFC Canada’s Vegan Sandwich Not Truly Vegan?
Tastes like chicken...
Filed under: animals, food & drink — michael @ 9:53 pm
Sure, KFC Canada has announced a new vegan option on their menu (thanks to PETA’s decades-long campaign against the fast-food giant) — but do they really get what being a vegan means? I’ll let the purists decide here. Check out this email we received from a reader earlier today:
“I live in Calgary, AB and I was really excited to try the new vegan KFC burger. I called my nearest location to see if they carried it and then asked them how they cooked it. They said they fry it up in the same fryer as the meat. This was very upsetting and I just wanted to pass this news along as I think it might be something that should be posted since it kind of defeats the whole Vegan thing. I still applaud PETA’s efforts but thought it might be info that should be passed along to others were are also a little misinformed.”
Hmmm…something tells me cooking a vegan sandwich in the same place as a chicken sandwich seconds before ain’t gonna cut it. Thoughts?
Oh no! That sucks! I guess the sandwich will be good for people just converting to a healthier diet. It will be a good option for meat eaters to abstain from slaughtered flesh for a meal. Other than that, most vegans will be grossed out.
Of course this is arguable, but unless someone is “allergic” to meat residue or simply can no longer abide the taste when meat touches their food it doesn’t make a lot of sense to reject the vegan option.
It’s not that vegan food is “contaminated” by being cooked on the grill near meat or thrown in the fryer with chicken. It’s all about the animals!! The main purpose of choosing vegan options is to save the lives of animals and if vegan food is cooked near or with meat, that doesn’t affect how many animals are killed.
Sure, most of us are turned off by the taste of meat and maybe the vegan sandwich pattie will have a bad flavor, which “would” be a good reason to reject it. But it shouldn’t be rejected simply because it is cooked near the meat.
However, I always reject vegan patties/fries, etc. that are cooked directly in animal fat because that act creates demand for the animal product, whereas the pattie cooked next to the meat on the grill or in with the chicken does not.
[...] ruh-roh. Ecorazzi.com caught a whiff of something meaty from one of their readers: “I live in Calgary, AB and I was really excited to try the new vegan [...]
I’m an ethical vegan and understand where you’re all coming from.
But….
It’s a great first start and - once they see the demand for compassionate food - can set the market standard for the most popular western food: fast food.
After this catches on, other stores with the capabilities for setting aside non-tainted measures, we can watch market competition take over.
[...] asked them how they cooked it. They said they fry it up in the same fryer as the meat. Source: Ecorazzi __________________ Robert Richmond | TechIMO Editor-in-Chief Infinite perceptions. One [...]
I agree with wordster. I don’t see what the big deal is, if there are no animal ingredients this should be good enough, hesitation over cross-contamination icky-ness doesn’t hold up from a purely ethical standpoint. Though I do wonder if the mayo is actually vegan.
They are advertising this as vegetarian, not vegan. Which are two very different things.
Hopefully, this is just growing-pains with KFC. This is new for them and a great first step. My wish is that it is not only made and cooked vegan, but that it is healthy. Vegan or not, white buns, deep-fried fake meat and fat ladened mayo is not my idea of a snack, let alone a meal.
Kudos for another baby-step forward however.
My thoughts PETA shouldn’t be pushing their ideals down the throats of people who don’t give a fuck. Eating meat is NOT going to kill you.
This is disappointing, but not surprising. Most places that have veggie burgers do the same (cook on same grill as meat).
I find it helps to ask them nicely to cook your food away from the main area. Most places are willing to please.
At the same time, don’t be difficult. The key is to show these restaurants that Veganism is becoming more popular and there is money to be made in compassionate capitalism.
I will say that I became a regular a this hot dog stand (on the street) where I bought veggie dogs on a regular basis. This guy installed a special grill to cook my veggie dog (seperate from the main grill.
There are always solutions to problems.
Peace
Dana, eating meat DOES kill animals, unnecessarily at that.
Also, the mayo KFC uses is regular mayo. It is not vegan. This sandwich is vegetarian, in the corrupted sense of the word that includes eggs and dairy (which, of course, were not plant-based products the last time I checked).
PS - I am not the 8:57pm Eric from 7/22.
This is from the PETA email that was sent out:The sandwich can easily be made vegan by ordering it in a wrap without mayonnaise.
IT DOES NOT ADVERTISE VEGAN!!
Yes, if they prepare it like that, that does suck. I did try it today, and have to say it is rather tasty. It is a victory for PETA.
Pardon me for sounding ignorant, but where does KFC say it’s vegan? I’ve read other people say it’s vegan, but I’ve only heard KFC say it’s meatless, which does not equal vegan.
Also, just because the sandwich is vegetarian doesn’t mean it was cooked using separate utensils/areas from meat, it just means it has no meat in it. Most of the vegetarian friends I have are okay with that as long as it’s not cooked in animal grease. But, people have their own definitions. My vegan friend only eats fast food fries at In-N-Out, as they don’t serve any other fried meat products, so only potatoes go into their friers.
Eric Prescott, I don’t see why calling something using eggs and dairy as vegetarian is ‘corrupted’. Vegetarian does not mean only plant-based products, that’s what vegan is for. Vegetarian means no meat, which eggs and dairy are not meat.
I for one applaud KFC for this move. The purest vegans and vegetarians will probably stay away, but if it can convince a meat-eater like me to enjoy a meat-free lunch, then I only see that as a good thing.
Normally we avoid fast food outlets like the plague, but traveling earlier today, we pulled over at a TacoBell, hoping we might be able to at least score some rice and beans to assuage our vegan hunger. When in the door of the store we noticed that it was actually both a KFC outlet and a TacoBell combined. When we asked about the vegetarian burger advertised, which you could get served with an optional caesar salad, it turned out that the dressing for the salad had anchovies in it (no surprise to us, but this was only determined after INSISTING (politely) that the sales clerk check the ingredients for us, even though she was ‘pretty sure’ we needn’t be concerned! It was obvious to us that our questions were annoying to her. So then the manager comes out, and eventually says that the vegetarian burger is cooked in the same oil as the chicken in their kitchen. It was have taken five minutes to try and get clear exactly what we could expect to be consuming. I tried to explain to the manager that his staff should be better prepared to answer customer questions about ingredients. He just didn’t seem to ‘get it’ that what they were promoting was not only misleading, it could actually be declared FALSE ADVERTISING.
Bummer! It’s a step in the right direction though, and kudos to KFC for taking it. I wish I could support it with my dollar, but the thought of it cooking in a vat with chunks of meat floating around isn’t appetizing to me at all. Maybe I’ll just buy one and give it to somebody else…
I agree with Dana. We are meant to eat meat. That is why animals are here in the first place. My mouth waters every time I drive by a cow on hooves.
Let’s just put aside the whole vegan/vegetarian aspect of this issue and realize that there’s a WHOLE ‘NOTHER kettle of worms here…
…what about all the people with poultry allergies who might have wanted to try this sandwich when friends wanted their fix for KFC?
If this veggie pattie is fried in the same fryer, wouldn’t the patties get some of the chicken fat infused into them? That’s just asking for people to go into anaphylactic shock!
You guys sound like a bunch of whiners. And how stupid would it be for someone who has a poultry allergy to be in KFC no matter what they were eating? Can’t you guys find something worthwhile to whine about like crime or pollution?
Oh come on, it just seems fair that popular restaurants should have at least ONE option for non-meat eaters. Since those complaining obviously don’t face the issues vegetarians/vegans face when going out to eat, it seems clear their inability to empathize is born out of ignorance. Grow up already. These are fair questions from a company trying to slap a label on something (’vegetarian’ for instance) and pair it with or include additional ingredients that defeat the label.
If your goal is to reduce the number of animals killed for food then a veggie burger cooked along side meat is fine. There is no increase in demand for animal products due to your decision to eat it. There is the gross factor, but if you are eating at KFC how picky can you be? I’ve found that the likelihood of vegans eating potentially contaminated (otherwise vegan) food is indirectly related to how long they have been vegan. After 12 years I’ve seen the strictest vegans come and go and am happy to have an additional option.
So many people use the “Vegetarian” label to mean their own personal food ideology that the term is fairly useless as any kind of standard for food preparation. Add in the part-time vegetarians, or the ‘Bacontarians’, and you’ve got a customer service nightmare ready-made and waiting for any company that wants to offer a cheap, ‘vegetarian’ meal.
@sam: Most fast food restaurants have offered salad options for years now. You might have to do some research to find a dressing that fits your particular definition of vegetarian(or vegan), but the option *is* there. It might not be nourishing(what Fast Food is?) or thrill your tastebuds, but it’s quick, convenient, and you can socialize with non-veg co-workers or friends over food.
Bottom line don’t ask the people who work at KFC how it’s done. And I know I’m going to get beat up for this one- but if you want to ask a kid or (worse) a person whose made a career out of working at KFC you’re probably not going to get the smartest answer. Call KFC headquarters and ask them. Chances are their employees are a bit more educated. Sad but true. Here’s the info for the KFC american headquarters but I don’t know the one is Canada.
KFC Headquarters Location 1441 Gardiner Ln. Louisville, KY 40213 Phone: 502-874-1000
And bottom line; I wouldn’t step in a KFC no matter what. If I were on the road and really only had fast food as an option I’d go to Subway (they’re everywhere) and get a vegetarian sandwich on wheat, hold the mayo. I’m not saying it’s the best but sure is better than KFC where the emphasis is on the meat!
pathetic. if they dont like it let them eat something else. like dirt. oh, wait, there might be tiny bacteria in it. they’re alive too, aren’t they? what about water? oops, there are thousands and thousands of tiny living things swimming around in each drop of water.
I dont see anything wrong with being vegetarian if one chooses to be, even though that isn’t what our bodies were designed for. but they weren’t designed for smoking either, among other things but that doesnt stop some people. Nor do I have a problem with people who object to animals being mistreated, and i especially don’t think much of people who hunt for sport or pleasure instead of food. But i find vegans to be an insult to nature, as evidenced by articles like this one. Are these people all allergic to meat? is there something in the meat that turns the grease left on the cooking surface toxic? maybe there is, in which case i’m wrong? But i wouldnt bet on it.
Anyway, I wouldn’t eat at kfc myself. I don’t like chicken. But I apparently like soybeans, becuase i eat at mcdonalds now and then.
I asked what the ingredients were and the manager told me she didn’t know and didn’t have a list of ingredients.
Whatever grease they cooked it in was sure heavy duty anbd tasted “lardy”.
I cannot see this being a big winner for anyone…
My bet is that KFC can and will start using a split-vat fryer to solve the problem. The newest and latest quest to fry it and buy it eating. If KFC needs to know about the fryer they need, please call me I sell them.
CIAO
As a 20-yr. vegetarian, I’ve learned that dining out is a challenge…from soup, to pasta sauce, to ‘meat free’ options, etc. I assume that fast food ‘meat free’ options are cooked/tainted on the same grills and fryers as meat. THE LARGER MORE SPECIFIC ISSUE WITH KFC is their processing of their chickens. There are many documented reports of cruel and abusive treatment of their chickens which eventually end up on the tables of KFC. So, even if KFC cooked their ‘meat free’ sandwhiches apart from their meat sandwhiches, I would NEVER purchase ANYTHING from that establishment. Their acts of cruelty are unforgivable.
Yeah if you eat at any restaurant that isn’t a strict veg establishment, you have to accept that your food is being cooked on or in the same surfaces/substances that meat is. I’m a decade-plus vegetarian, as of this year pescatarian, and am over it. There are bigger fish to fry.
[...] began selling a vegan, “Unchicken” sandwich in its Canadian locations. Guess what? It’s not vegetarian.A reader at “green gossip” website Ecorazzi reported that the local KFC says it fries [...]
The things are deep fried in the same vat that chicken pieces are cooked in.
So it’s no surprise it tastes like their chicke.
Each time a piece of chicken is fried in any starting fat, its chicken fat is rendered into the cooking fat mix and more fat gets added to the vat than started out. So the “faux chicken” veggie patty is actually partly chicken … the fat part!
Kodey says on July 23rd, 2008 at 8:26 am
I agree with Dana. We are meant to eat meat. That is why animals are here in the first place [...]
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Yea this is completely untrue, and you can make sure to keep eating meat to garuantee you get high cholesteral, cancer, and all kinds of other disseases.
I started reading about this kind of stuff, and people who say we all are natural born meat eaters, this is completely untrue.
This is why…
1. something has to eat a plant right?
2. even if its far up in the food chain, the cow or chicken or [fill in the blank]
had to have ate something that originally ate a plant
3. there for, all you are doing is eating something that has all of the plant and more animals inside it [which is pollution for your body] and getting the original plant protein.
that is one very small reason on why you shouldnt eat meat…
It is like putting fresh spring water into a sewage system and drinking that… you dont need all of that sewage in your water!
“eating meat DOES kill animals, unnecessarily at that.”
wait wait wait… so we can eat meat and not kill animals? Please elaborate.
Um, not to be an asshole, but why would any ethical vegan/vegetarian/meat lover eat at KFC at all? Isn’t quibbling over the oil a much smaller “beef” than how they kill and prep their chickens?
Why would any vegetarian even support KFC in the first place, unless you are traveling with a whole bunch of friends and you stop at KFC and there is no other place around to eat at?
One issue that hasn’t been touched on is whether a vegetarian should order the “vegan” (if you can call it that) sandwich at KFC to simply support the company’s decision to put (and keep) it on the menu. The fact is that if a vegan chicken sandwich doesn’t sell they’ll simply take it off the menu. This happened a few years ago at Burger King with the vegan veggie burger.
In case you don’t know the story, the Burger King in Watkins Glen, New York was the first location to introduce a veggie burger (thanks to the folks at Farm Sanctuary) and eventually Burger King went out on a limb and made the burger vegan. The vegan version didn’t sell and so they went back to the original veggie patty, which included dairy and eggs.
I actually haven’t decided what side I’m on here. A part of thinks it’s silly to support the companies that directly contribute to the abuse and slaughter of more than 10 billion animals a year. Then there’s the other side — the idea that if we vegans and vegetarians don’t support those choices they’ve given us they’ll no longer be around. Is that such a bad thing? Maybe…maybe not. I often feel for young vegetarians in perhaps less progressive areas who aren’t privileged to a plethora of veggie food most of us experience. Will this option somehow encourage them to continue choosing the vegetarian lifestyle? It’s something to think about…that’s all. But I don’t (knowingly) eat food that has shared the same oil, cooking space, etc. with animal products. That’s after 7 years of veganism though. Certainly when I began the journey I wasn’t as strict.
[...] a little debate amongst meat-eaters and vegetarians alike when rumors surfaced that the sandwich may not be as vegan as we thought. What do you think? Was Pamela’s visit to KFC diplomatic or idiotic? Chime in, [...]
You guys need to get a f#$%#@* life. Is it any more/less ethical to eat a chicken then it is to use electricity derived from fossil fuels, that will slowly kill all living things on the planet. Especially when that electricty is powering the computer you are spewing your utter nonsense from right now.
Lets face it - we don’t live in an ideal world. There are shades of gray to everything including vegetarianism. The argument about the definition of vegetarianism can lead us off track - the more important issue is trying to make things *better* both in ourselves and in the world around us. When I was a child my family ate red meat every day. Now, at least 2 or 3 nights a week my parents eat a meatless meal. They are *not* vegetarian - no question of that. But is the way they eat now better than the way they ate when I was young? Well, there are generally 3 reasons to be vegetarian - health, ethics & environment. Certainly it is healthier to eat meat sometimes than all the time. Eating meat less often means that less animals are killed which seems a good thing to me. And getting more of your calories lower down on the food chain is better for the environment than getting them all from animals. Would I like the entire world to go vegan overnight - absolutely! Is there any chance of this happening - absolutely not! Given that, I think that every move *towards* a more vegetarian world is better than maintaining the status quo. So is a non-vegan un-chicken sandwich that may contain some chicken fat ideal? No, but it is still better than eating a real chicken sandwich. KFC should be applauded for a move in the right direction - and perhaps with a bit of gentle persuasion they will move even further: using a separate frier, adding more vegetarian options, creating a *vegan* sandwich etc. If we boycott KFC and rant about the sandwich not being vegan, it is *much* more likely that KFC will give up and stop offering the sandwich at all. It is not a perfect world - but I would rather have an imperfect vegetarian choice than have no choice at all.
I am vegan and I suppose I am strict (although I don’t understand the idea of a vegan who would be relaxed on the idea of eating something vegan that’s cooked in an animal product?)…anyhow, I will not be trying this product. I WANT to try it, I WANT to support KFC for making this change because, even though they continue to profit from slaughtering animals, they are taking a step in the right direction. I worry that the vegetarian patty may not be a permanent fixture but then again, isn’t the real win for animals here the fact that they will be purchasing their chicken only from CAK slaughterhouses, which means that the lives of those birds aren’t going to end as in as horrific a manner as they have been? It’s not a lot, I realize this, but those who campaign for ethical treatment of animals (for the most part) would agree that every step, no matter how small, is extremely important in changing the way our society perceives the rights (lack thereof) of animals?
For those of you who are non-vegan/non-vegetarian making comments like “don’t you have better things to whine about”…don’t YOU? This is obviously a forum for people who think the issue IS a big deal so if you don’t, and don’t have any rational comments to make related to the issue itself, why are you wasting your time here?
in addition to my previous comment, I have just contacted two different KFC stores in my area (New Westminster & Burnaby on 10th) and they informed me that they use vegetable oil in their fryers and if you call ahead to find out whether they’ve just changed the oil in the fries fryer to fresh oil, you would then know whether the product would actually be cooked in just vegetable oil. so for those of you who WOULD like to try this product and show your support for KFC’s decision to offer it, you can do a bit of leg work, call ahead and there you go. One restaurant actually told me that if I wanted it, they could turn on one of the fryers they’d just changed the oil in so it would be hot when I got there and make the patty for me. For those sticklers who understand that cleaning out a fryer doesn’t get all the chicken fat out, well you’re like me…you won’t be going. But for you so-so strictees, this might be the answer you’re looking for.
If you don’t want them to fry it.. just kindly ask them to microwave it
[...] & KFC Ecorazzi KFC Logo 1 KFC Logo 2 KFC Logo 3 Treehugger China’s Air Environmental Expert China’s Air Wall [...]
get it right people animals were not put here for people to eat…..GET YOUR RESEARCH FACTS STRAIGHT
[...] the fast-food chain over the conditions of raising and killing the chickens used in their meals. A small amount of controversy erupted later after it was found that the vegetarian sandwiches were being fried in the same oil as their [...]
Such interesting discussions here. I’m glad that this hasn’t been tainted by slanderous “abolitionist” theory (which I find highly offense, as I seek animal liberation as well, just through an incremental path). Although VERY small, this is a victory. Exposing people to tasty veggie options is good. I meet more and more meat eaters all the time who enjoy eating vegetarian, especially vegetarian meats. People are becoming more open-minded and we need to continue to advocate for things like this within the capitalist market to keep the demand for cruelty-free products rising.
I am indeed a strict vegan, but to all the vegans out there: remember that we are role models to the rest of the world. If a friend/relative/co-worker sees us flip out because of the oil a veggie patty was cooked in, how does that help animals or promote veganism? It simply makes us look like insane fanatics. Think about it. Veganism is simply a means to an end (animal liberation) and not an end within itself. This is not about personal purity and self-righteousness, this is about helping animals. It saddens me when vegans loose site of this.
Some animals eat other animals. Some people eat animals, and yes, unfortunately some people eat other people. Why? Because meat tastes SO GOOD!
I have to agree with Ann about why any sincere vegan would set foot in a fast food establishment, let alone patronize one.
Most ‘vegans’ and ‘vegetarians’ I’ve met made the conversion because a) they hit college and realize the price of meat in a grocery store for the first time, or b) they need to give themselves a sense of moral superiority ’cause they couldn’t get laid in high school.
I give these converts a year at the most before they break, donning a pair of oversize sunglasses to embark incognito on a run to a nearby burger shack.
Mmmmmmmmmm.
By the way, if the ‘meatless’ patty isn’t meat, what is it?
You know… they sell meat in the same store that they sell vegetables. Hell, they grow slaughter animals sometimes on the same land as they grow vegetables. Does that meant you shouldn’t eat vegetables? :\
I think people need to separate living a compassionate livestyle from turning it into a religion. This shouldn’t be an issue of kosher/unclean. When you buy the sandwich you killed no animals & you let KFC know that you support a veggie sandwich.
As a studying nutritionist, I’ve learned that cholesterol, found only in animal products, is most present in the “fat” portion of the meat, in particular. That being said, when the real chicken is fried in grease repeatedly, actual chicken fat deposits are left in the deep fryer (this I know from working in fast food restaurants) The result is that you could get minute amounts of cholesterol on the vegetarian chicken. If that’s not reason enough, what if I think it’s just gross . . . what if there was a restaurant that would kill, chop, batter, and fry your best friend, or your mom . . . would you want to eat something cooked in the same grease that your friend was cooked in? No. Some vegans/vegetarians don’t really care if their food touches animal products before being eaten. That’s respectable. Some of us just think it’s gross like, when you were a kid and tried olives for the first time. Stop saying we should “eat it anyway” . . . it’s not healthy, and if we don’t want to eat it we won’t. It has nothing to do with being “overzealous, or religious” and everything to do with being just plain grossed out. End of story.
Hi there,
I personally don’t care if it’s cooked in the same grease or not. I’m not a veagan anyways. But I was just wondering how many calories do these KFC vegetarian sandwiches have?
Does anyone know please? I’ve looked all over the net and couldn’t find any info on that.