You listed a bunch of examples where you disagree with how some governments have used their militaries. This does not make the people who decide to serve their country any less honorable.

Yes the current financial chaos was triggered in the US, but no, Iceland wouldn’t be bankrupt today if they hadn’t massively over-leveraged their banking industry. That’s their fault alone. Furthermore, shocks like this happen from time to time completely unpredictably, it seems to be natural to the financial system. In the past we’ve had the tech bubble, Russian default, Asian crisis, South American defaults..

It’s frightening how black and white issues like the Georgian conflict seem to be to you. Let me offer an alternative explanation: Historically Ossetians are a relatively independent people, only recently Russia decided to start giving them passports. This then gives Russia a convenient reason to meddle in the affairs of their neighbors. They feel the need to do this in order to secure their lines of energy export. Depending on who you listen to, the current military action started either because Georgians shelled Ossetian civilians, or because Ossetian separatists attacked Georgian forces who were forced to retaliate. It is precisely these types of complex conflicts that I meant in my last post. And “police” will certainly not be the solution as you seem to suggest.

Finally this “someone is only attacked if in some way has attacked others first”. Then, by this same argument the “someone” who “attacked others first” only did so because they themselves were attacked previously. This can be extended indefinitely, and we can observe that since it’s not possible to have a “first attacker” then it would logically follow that there are no attacks in the world – which is clearly false.

Your apparent attempt to clarify your false argument by stating: “what I meant was that a nation only suffers a retaliation if somehow it has first attacked the one who retaliated” is not very helpful. By definition one can only “retaliate” if one has been attacked first. Thus the argument is vacuous.

Maybe we cannot save all the lives lost in the war so far – the soldiers and civilians on all sides… but we can sign a petition to save a life of this dog.. and perhaps the life of the soldier who has spent 15 months in HELL! She was obviously young when she signed up and as the smart veggie tart pointed out – those recruiters can be stalker hawks when they come after these kids.

bottom line sign the petition – hopefully she can AND her dog can get the hell out of that hell and come home to her parents.

http://www.thepetitionsite.com/1/release-ratchet-from-iraq-now

please cite your sources for this “fact”. if they are from political talking heads only, then i fail to see how that constitutes “fact” and does not merely fall into the category of opinion.

also, you haven’t the slightest what my point of view is, personally. my initial post was only to point out to you that YOUR OPINION does NOT constitute fact, as you seem so convinced.

ERIN, sweetie (and I am not using this word in any patronising way, on the contrary, it’s one of my favourite English words and I only use it with a positive connotation – I hope you don’t mind), I am deeply sorry for the resentment I caused you.

jamie lynn:
How can I put this without offending you or your family? Soldiers eventually end up killing, whether they like it or not! There are probably soldiers who are better persons than me! Nevertheless, as far as I know, your soldiers are professionals and thus they apply for that job. Nobody forces them!
They have to follow orders whatever they may be – this includes killing those animals!!
And when I generalise (particularly you regarding your soldiers as heroes), I don’t mean that each and every American sees their soldiers as heroes, but in general you do! That is a fact! I am constantly watching and reading all that talk about “our soldiers, the heroes who fight for freedom and democracy,” etc. But let me stress that that’s your point of view. But it’s not necessarily the rest of the world’s point of view!
In spite of everything I sincerely hope your husband will never have to kill another living creature and I hope nothing bad will ever happen to him!

fbr:
I have ‘argued’ with you before and, as always, you have never been able, or never wanted, to really understand what I write here!
I know that the Americans are not the only ones who regard their soldiers as heroes, although you overdo with their appraisement as no other culture does. However this piece of news mentions the US military and that’s what I focused on…
Soldiers, apart from the UN peacekeeping forces, are not protecting you, me nor anyone else – instead, they protect the interests of big corporations and governments. Therefore I owe soldiers absolutely nothing !!! Do you see any military forces doing something to solve the situation in Tibet, Darfur (even though the UN is involved at some level) and in so many other places? No, you don’t see entire armies there because corporations and governments have no interests there to protect!
Regarding the fact that we can’t even conceive a world without soldiers and wars, it says a lot about us as a species – we have the technology but we don’t have the wisdom and the level of evolution required to live in peace. That is why a song like ‘Imagine’ is still, unfortunately, seen as a utopia!
About conflicts between people – that’s why we have the police… Common people all over the world just want to live their lives in peace! It’s the big corporations and governments who make wars and that’s why the military forces serve really under their command!!! You don’t believe the entire population of a country all of a sudden rises up and decides to attack a neighbouring country, do you? Just one example, I once saw a documentary about oil companies in Nigeria – did you know that the major company (I think it was Shell) exploiting oil there, ‘controlled’ the government and the military and even told them to repress any protest made by local people? Local villagers who protested were usually taken prisoners and one of the leaders was actually tortured or murdered (which one it was I don’t remember for sure)! These were not rebels, they were common people protesting against the destruction of their environment, their villages and their way of life by the oil companies!
When I mentioned that the financial crisis was bush’s fault, I didn’t mean he did it all by himself…Come on! You are a not a 12 year old! Read between the lines! Nonetheless, who is in charge of your country? Who is the commander in chief?
The beginning of this financial collapse was triggered in the US and you know it! Do you have any idea how multinationals spread their businesses? They are like ‘cancers’! They are everywhere, so if one major corporation falls, others follow…
“Someone is only attacked if in some way has attacked others first.” – do I have to spell everything out for you? Damn…this is tiresome… It’s no fallacy! What I meant was that a nation only suffers a retaliation if somehow it has first attacked the one who retaliated! Why do you think 9/11 happened? Because of the US military and your government! The US administration has manipulated for years elections in several countries! Who put saddam hussein in power, for instance? Recently, who incited Georgia to attack South Ossetia? Russia only entered Georgian territory to make a stand against the US decision of placing a missile defence system in Poland! How naive can you be? Things eventually come around…!
In case you don’t know, Europe doesn’t really have enemies and wasn’t afraid of attacks before 9/11! Recent terrorist attacks only happened after we joined you in the invasion of Iraq. Up until then we were ‘completely’ safe!
Your image abroad is now the worst ever! Most of the rest of the world sees America not as a friend, but as a bully which is dangerous to be friends with!
And by the way, I have never been into the conspiracy theories, but yesterday I watched something that if it’s true is very alarming.
As I am in no position to make a valid judgement about it, I leave here the link and you can judge by yourself whether this could be true or if it’s just an absurdity. Either way it is worth watching – if it’s real then you are in deep s***; if it’s not, it’s ‘interesting’ to watch!
http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=Z586rnEI6Qo&feature=related

VeggieTart:
I also mostly blame the generals, governments and big corporations for the war. However soldiers in most of the cases chose to be soldiers! And when they do exactly what they are told, no matter what, they do become soulless fighting machines. A very sad example of this is the images of what US (mainly) and other nation’s soldiers did to prisoners in Iraq!! I don’t mean by this that all soldiers are monsters but I wouldn’t trust them very much. After a while, the things they have done in war affect them beyond our wildest imagination! I once met a former mercenary (true!) and before I knew who he had been, I considered him to be a peaceful and gentle person although he had very a strange behaviour! As time went by, after I was told what he had done in his life, I understood his behaviour! He now spent whole days drinking and smoking at a bar and he was obviously a tortured, delusional human being! Ironically he died suffocated by a piece of food!

So, I think I got a pretty good idea of what war does to a person!

All of this to state that I maintain my position:
- soldiers are no heroes!
- the US has sadly become a bully!
- bush, his administration and the corporations he protects have seriously ‘damaged’ the world!
- furthermore, your military forces have ruined your economy and they will be the end of you (remember the Romans?)!
- oh, and right now china owns your ‘ass’!

And again I am no anti-American jerk – on the contrary, as I have stated before, I love the USA. And that’s what pisses me off when I see that great nation become zombified and manipulated by the media, the military, big corporations and ultimately, by your own administration!

It’s very sad!

Nevertheless, blessed be and I hope you can emerge again as a true beacon for the rest of the world!

I am SO SORRY for this extended comment… thanks for your patience!

Unfortunately, the last chance he has to leave Iraq is early next week and the military needs to issue an official order to release him. (So we’re still very worried.)

If anyone is interested, I posted an update on Ratchet’s situation and some specific things people can do to help him. It’s at: http://www.getfreshminds.com/2008/10/help-ratchet.html

If you have some time, we’d really appreciate a little more help. Thank you so much!

~Katie (Gwen’s friend)