by Michael dEstries
Categories: People.

Events are unfolding at the Discovery Channel headquarters in Silver Spring, Maryland — where a a man with a gun and possible explosives entered the premises at around 1pm EST. Reports indicate that there may be a hostage involved and the entire building is on lockdown.

There are also reports that demands that have been posted online at a web address called “Save The Planet Protest”. The list, which was posted by a man named “Lee”, focuses on human overpopulation and says that Discovery must revamp their programming schedule immediately to address this issue — and others like global warming, world hunger, etc.

“The Discovery Channel and it’s affiliate channels MUST have daily television programs at prime time slots based on Daniel Quinn’s “My Ishmael” pages 207-212 where solutions to save the planet would be done in the same way as the Industrial Revolution was done, by people building on each other’s inventive ideas. Focus must be given on how people can live WITHOUT giving birth to more filthy human children since those new additions continue pollution and are pollution. A game show format contest would be in order. Perhaps also forums of leading scientists who understand and agree with the Malthus-Darwin science and the problem of human overpopulation. Do both. Do all until something WORKS and the natural world starts improving and human civilization building STOPS and is reversed! MAKE IT INTERESTING SO PEOPLE WATCH AND APPLY SOLUTIONS!!!!”

Check out the full list of demands after the fold below. We will update as events unfold.

[UPDATE: Rumor has the gunman being this person named "Lee"]

[UPDATE 2: Live news feed added below:

[UPDATE #3: Lee has been shot and killed. Police say at least one explosive device managed to go off. Hostages are all safe. More details here.]

Lee’s list of Demands

The Discovery Channel MUST broadcast to the world their commitment to save the planet and to do the following IMMEDIATELY:
1. The Discovery Channel and it’s affiliate channels MUST have daily television programs at prime time slots based on Daniel Quinn’s “My Ishmael” pages 207-212 where solutions to save the planet would be done in the same way as the Industrial Revolution was done, by people building on each other’s inventive ideas. Focus must be given on how people can live WITHOUT giving birth to more filthy human children since those new additions continue pollution and are pollution. A game show format contest would be in order. Perhaps also forums of leading scientists who understand and agree with the Malthus-Darwin science and the problem of human overpopulation. Do both. Do all until something WORKS and the natural world starts improving and human civilization building STOPS and is reversed! MAKE IT INTERESTING SO PEOPLE WATCH AND APPLY SOLUTIONS!!!!

2. All programs on Discovery Health-TLC must stop encouraging the birth of any more parasitic human infants and the false heroics behind those actions. In those programs’ places, programs encouraging human sterilization and infertility must be pushed. All former pro-birth programs must now push in the direction of stopping human birth, not encouraging it.

3. All programs promoting War and the technology behind those must cease. There is no sense in advertising weapons of mass-destruction anymore. Instead, talk about ways to disassemble civilization and concentrate the message in finding SOLUTIONS to solving global military mechanized conflict. Again, solutions solutions instead of just repeating the same old wars with newer weapons. Also, keep out the fraudulent peace movements. They are liars and fakes and had no real intention of ending the wars. ALL OF THEM ARE FAKE! On one hand, they claim they want the wars to end, on the other, they are demanding the human population increase. World War II had 2 Billion humans and after that war, the people decided that tripling the population would assure peace. WTF??? STUPIDITY! MORE HUMANS EQUALS MORE WAR!

4. Civilization must be exposed for the filth it is. That, and all its disgusting religious-cultural roots and greed. Broadcast this message until the pollution in the planet is reversed and the human population goes down! This is your obligation. If you think it isn’t, then get hell off the planet! Breathe Oil! It is the moral obligation of everyone living otherwise what good are they??

5. Immigration: Programs must be developed to find solutions to stopping ALL immigration pollution and the anchor baby filth that follows that. Find solutions to stopping it. Call for people in the world to develop solutions to stop it completely and permanently. Find solutions FOR these countries so they stop sending their breeding populations to the US and the world to seek jobs and therefore breed more unwanted pollution babies. FIND SOLUTIONS FOR THEM TO STOP THEIR HUMAN GROWTH AND THE EXPORTATION OF THAT DISGUSTING FILTH! (The first world is feeding the population growth of the Third World and those human families are going to where the food is! They must stop procreating new humans looking for nonexistant jobs!)

6. Find solutions for Global Warming, Automotive pollution, International Trade, factory pollution, and the whole blasted human economy. Find ways so that people don’t build more housing pollution which destroys the environment to make way for more human filth! Find solutions so that people stop breeding as well as stopping using Oil in order to REVERSE Global warming and the destruction of the planet!

7. Develop shows that mention the Malthusian sciences about how food production leads to the overpopulation of the Human race. Talk about Evolution. Talk about Malthus and Darwin until it sinks into the stupid people’s brains until they get it!!

8. Saving the Planet means saving what’s left of the non-human Wildlife by decreasing the Human population. That means stopping the human race from breeding any more disgusting human babies! You’re the media, you can reach enough people. It’s your resposibility because you reach so many minds!!!

9. Develop shows that will correct and dismantle the dangerous US world economy. Find solutions for their disasterous Ponzi-Casino economy before they take the world to another nuclear war.

10. Stop all shows glorifying human birthing on all your channels and on TLC. Stop Future Weapons shows or replace the dialogue condemning the people behind these developments so that the shows become exposes rather than advertisements of Arms sales and development!

11. You’re also going to find solutions for unemployment and housing. All these unemployed people makes me think the US is headed toward more war.

Humans are the most destructive, filthy, pollutive creatures around and are wrecking what’s left of the planet with their false morals and breeding culture.

For every human born, ACRES of wildlife forests must be turned into farmland in order to feed that new addition over the course of 60 to 100 YEARS of that new human’s lifespan! THIS IS AT THE EXPENSE OF THE FOREST CREATURES!!!! All human procreation and farming must cease!

It is the responsiblity of everyone to preserve the planet they live on by not breeding any more children who will continue their filthy practices. Children represent FUTURE catastrophic pollution whereas their parents are current pollution. NO MORE BABIES! Population growth is a real crisis. Even one child born in the US will use 30 to a thousand times more resources than a Third World child. It’s like a couple are having 30 babies even though it’s just one! If the US goes in this direction maybe other countries will too!

Also, war must be halted. Not because it’s morally wrong, but because of the catastrophic environmental damage modern weapons cause to other creatures. FIND SOLUTIONS JUST LIKE THE BOOK SAYS! Humans are supposed to be inventive. INVENT, DAMN YOU!!

The world needs TV shows that DEVELOP solutions to the problems that humans are causing, not stupify the people into destroying the world. Not encouraging them to breed more environmentally harmful humans.

Saving the environment and the remaning species diversity of the planet is now your mindset. Nothing is more important than saving them. The Lions, Tigers, Giraffes, Elephants, Froggies, Turtles, Apes, Raccoons, Beetles, Ants, Sharks, Bears, and, of course, the Squirrels.

The humans? The planet does not need humans.

You MUST KNOW the human population is behind all the pollution and problems in the world, and YET you encourage the exact opposite instead of discouraging human growth and procreation. Surely you MUST ALREADY KNOW this!

I want Discovery Communications to broadcast on their channels to the world their new program lineup and I want proof they are doing so. I want the new shows started by asking the public for inventive solution ideas to save the planet and the remaining wildlife on it.

These are the demands and sayings of Lee.

About Michael dEstries

Michael has been blogging since 2005 on issues such as sustainability, renewable energy, philanthropy, and healthy living. He regularly contributes to a slew of publications, as well as consulting with companies looking to make an impact using the web and social media. He lives in Ithaca, NY with his family on an apple farm.

View all posts by Michael dEstries →
  • http://www.facebook.com/people/Kyle-Russell/1646163362 Kyle Russell

    NUTTER

  • JonnyJoo

    The website you’ve posted appears to be down but it is still viewable at the following link:

    http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:wRb2N5UYIwAJ:www.savetheplanetprotest.com/+http://savetheplanetprotest.com/&cd=1&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=uk&client=firefox-a

    If this is true (I’m not sure it is) this guy has set back the environmentalist cause years by doing this. I can only imagine how bad the repercussions of this will be.

  • dave

    My Ishmail? Is this clown smoking his own shorts?/ ha ha ha ha etc.

  • http://www.beforewisdom.com beforewisdom

    A friend of mine facebooked me at the start of the crisis. She is trapped in the building via the lockdown. Crap, I hope this ends well.

  • http://www.beforewisdom.com beforewisdom

    I would like to suggest that ecorazzi change the title of this thread.

    The government has a strict criteria for the word “terrorist”. For example, that Texan who flew his plane into the IRS building was not a “terrorist” because he was working alone.

    The word “terrorist” is used to smear the image of legitimate activists acting within the law and hurting nobody. I suggest learning more about the issue by visiting

    http://www.greenisthenewred.com/blog/

    I also suggest not making the problem worse by throwing the title “terrorist” around

    Thanks in advance

    • http://www.ecorazzi.com Michael d'Estries

      I actually decided to change the title even before reading your suggestion, BeforeWisdom. It’s updated.

    • Shan

      I have seen civilians being arrested in the search of “suspected” terrorists,
      while there is a man with explosives and intention to kill people is called
      environmentalist. Hahah, good people in media.

  • Franklin

    Real, smart environmentalists would never do something like this. Sure there is some truth to his writings and beliefs but his priorities and actions concerning his principles are ridiculous and ignorant. This tactic always puts the agenda on the frontline for ridicule.

  • Cho cho ma

    He just got killed by SWAT. No other confirmed injuries have been reported. There are still possible bombs in the building.

  • http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=1076105348 Hart

    Hey, at least he forced the MSM to utter the phrase “human over-population” for the first time in a decade.

  • Michael Raymer

    ” and, of course, the Squirrels.”

    Well, up until that line, I thought he was nutz.

  • http://www.beforewisdom.com beforewisdom

    It is great that the authors of ecorazzi removed the term “eco terrorist” out of the title, but is the now deceased perpetrator really an “extreme environmentalist” and not just an unstable person who latched onto something the way some people do? Please call this person what he was, unstable and don’t use terms which dis people trying to make the world a better place. No offense and thanks.

  • Kimitake Hiraoka

    When I first saw the headline in the newspaper, I wondered if perhaps someone had decided to give the Discovery Channel a taste of its own medicine for its support of Sea Shepherd’s violence campaign of terrorism.

    But no, it seems the perpetrator was of the same insane and misanthropic ilk as the ocean-going thugs of the SSCS.

    Still, this isn’t without an element of irony I suppose.

    Out of curiosity though, at what point would you people concede that acts of violence or (threatened violence) carried out in the name of “environmentalism” is indeed an act of terrorism?

    I mean, you seem perfectly comfortable with the ramming of ships and throwing of acid. And now you appear to be strangely at ease with someone strapping explosives to themselves and threatening to blow up a building and the people inside it.

    So at what point does such “direct action” (I’m assuming that’s what you call it) cross the line? Or is it, as Paul Watson suggests, that there is no line?

    Michael d’Estries, would you care to weigh in on this one?

    • From MN, with hope…

      Seriously? A guy got killed and you piss all over this thread by spewing your anti-Sea Shepherd BS? Sea Shepherd has had NOTHING to do with this. The acid is harmful. If it is, than prove it. Show us pictures of the victims. Sea Shepherd hasn’t rammed anybody in a long while. Direct action won’t pose a direct threat to the lives of people, while this guy had a gun, and hostages. I’m going to leave it at that before I go out of control.

      Michael, I am going to make a request Kimi be banned from Ecorazzi for trolling. He goes into every thread remotely related to Sea Shepherd (even if the ties are far, like this one for example), and baits everyone. Please rid us of him.

      • Michael Raymer

        I gotta vote against you on this one MN. If you look at the tab, “Most Popular Posts of the Day”, you see that hundreds of people come through here on a daily basis. I, for one, want the general public to see who it is that supports the slaughter of dolphins and whales. Much like a KKK rally, you can either hide and ignore, or you can show the kiddies what they can turn into if they’re not careful. If Kimitake is the best that the other side can find to represent their interests, the future’s so bright I gotta wear shades. The man has got to be worth $10,000 in SSCS contributions all by himself.

      • Kimitake Hiraoka

        Don’t say that Michael… It agonises me that I might inadvertantly assist the SS cause…

        Just imagine what $10,000 could do in the hands of a real environmental/conservation group, like Greenpeace. Real results on real issues.

        But instead, we’ll only get more fund raising cruises in the Southern Ocean, more expensive boats, more expensive helicopters, more acid, more lasers, more crimes, more pay cheques for Paul Watson, more trashed boats and diesel oil poured into the ocean, and more hardening of attitudes by those who are targetted by the SS thugs.

        How depressing.

      • Michael Raymer

        Deal with it Kimitake. You are probably one of SSCS’s best friends. Keep up the good work.

      • From MN, with hope…

        Pardon, I meant to say ‘the acid isn’t harmful.’ I guess my fingers make more typos when I’m mad.

      • David

        No you had it right the first time. Chemists and the manufacturers all agree that it is harmful. I don’t need pictures to prove it the published scientific data is fine.

        I could claim that if you don’t have pictures with proof that Japanese people are being made sick from mercury from eating dolphin meat, that must prove that mercury is harmless. Because that would be stupid. It is easy to find the chemical info that shows mercury is harmful just like it is easy to find the chemical info that butyric acid is harmful.

        Heck even the Canadian court that found Paul Watson guilty of a felony based it in part on the fact that butyric acid is harmful.

      • From MN, with hope…

        Get over it, you guys got your wish. No more butyric acid. It CAN be harmful, but the stuff Sea Shepherd uses isn’t. For a group of people who take pictures of the Bob Barker just to call it’s crew cockroaches you’d think they’d have at least ONE photo of evidence to prove these alleged acid burns. And it has yet to be proven that the stuff Sea Shepherd used was harmful. You’ve got a tough job now, convincing me that the butyric acid that Sea Shepherd uses is harmful.

      • David

        I don’t have to prove anything, Sherlock. Paul Watson’s felony conviction already proved that the Butyric acid they use is harmful.

      • From MN, with hope…

        Well Paul hasn’t been convicted recently, so when was this?

      • David

        Sorry Sherlock. I am not doing your research for you. The topic has been discussed here a number of times over the last year. It was discussed at the AP forum. And it was discussed on the SSCS forum.

      • From MN, with hope…

        No, really, which conviction was it? Just a year and country is all I need, and I’ll research it for myself. Paul’s been in so many times it’s crazy. Plus this exact conversation keeps coming up in Google.

      • David

        OK, I give up on you. With an simple search I found where it was discussed in another thread at ecorazzi back in April.

        And you know what I found? A comment by you! So you where actually involved in a conversation that covered everything about the conviction. So either you are lying or you have a serious memory problem to go with your inability to search the internet.

    • Michael Raymer

      Well, if we’re going to bring explosives into this, care to explain the use of concussion grenades by the wussy-hero whaling fleet? Care to explain their use against people armed only with bottles and cellulose powder. By your own definition, the whalers are terrorists and should be treated as such. They have never demonstated any legal mandate to use explosives, but there they are. Thanx for bringing this to a whole new dimension.

    • Kimitake Hiraoka

      Oh dear, you poor sensitive soul. I didn’t realise you’d suddenly concerned yourself with the well being of human beings.

      I didn’t say Sea Shepherd had anything to do with this. Please read my posts carefully before spewing forth your vitriol.

      I will also remind you that an operative of Sea Shepherd was tried and convicted of assault in a court of law for injuring a person with chemical burns from an acid projectile he launched. Tried and convicted for the crime.

      And when you ram a vessel in the remote Southern Ocean at speed, you put the lives of both crews in serious risk of unjury and death. If the SSCS thugs pulled it off in the territorial waters of any country, they’d be arrested.

      Lastly, I suggest you try to keep your cool a little more. There’s a new regime in place here and I shouldn’t be surprised if you particular brand of interjection falls foul of the new rules.

      • Michael Raymer

        “And when you ram a vessel in the remote Southern Ocean at speed, you put the lives of both crews in serious risk of unjury and death. If the SSCS thugs pulled it off in the territorial waters of any country, they’d be arrested.”

        Ooooh, dig that hole. One of your boys rammed the Bob Barker at speed during the last campaign. So, I guess your indictment involves the whalers also.

      • From MN, with hope…

        Well I got worked up, and apologize for my tone and wording, but I stand by what I said. Duh I care for humans, without an ocean there’s no humans. And don’t say it wasn’t about Sea Shepherd because the first thing you said was ‘When I first saw the headline in the newspaper, I wondered if perhaps someone had decided to give the Discovery Channel a taste of its own medicine for its support of Sea Shepherd’s violence campaign of terrorism.’ Indeed Pete was convicted, but the Japanese government run the courts, and support the whaling industry. I assume Pete got off because it would cause major backlash if he were to be put in jail directly. Although I did know that you would pull that one, but again I ask for evidence in pictures of the acid burns. Or maybe a video demonstrating this. The only reason the whalers jump off on the whole ‘acid burns’ thing is because it’s called butyric acid. If Sea Shepherd were still using pie filling, or whatever, than the whalers would have nothing to whine about. But you got your wish, and no more rotten butter bombs. Finally you admit it! The Shonan Maru 2 clearly rammed the Ady Gil at speed, and they need to take responsibility. Even Maritime New Zealand thinks so. If the SM2 cut the nose off the Ady Gil in territorial waters than the SM2 would have a Coast Guard tail in no time, and they would be convicted.

    • http://www.ecorazzi.com Michael d'Estries

      Kimitake’s question was a fair one.

      The difference for me is that Lee walked into Discovery with intent to do serious harm to people. He was shot after he pointed a gun at someone. Not to mention the fact that the explosives he was carrying were real — with one of them actually going off.

      Sea Shepherd on the other hand do not enter situations looking to harm people. Do they get in the way of whalers? Absolutely. But they’re not attempting to kill them in the process or cause injury. We didn’t see Pete Bethune climb aboard the Maru #2 claiming to have explosives or carrying a gun. (Yes, he had a knife, but I think we can agree that was to cut the anti-boarding net on the side of the ship.)

      Is it a fine line? Sure. And I definitely believe that both sides cross it from time to time. The point is, nobody is trying to kill each other. It’s much more harassment than terrorism.

  • robert m

    somehow the word ‘environmentalist’ seems inadequate nowadays

    probably because our problems have widened in scope – it’s not so much about saving the rain forests anymore just because rain forests deserve to be saved – it’s more about saving rain forests because if we don’t it means the end of the species – our species

    same as the vegan trip – originally it was about the rights of sentient beings, but now it seems to have grown into something that is necessary if not to ensure human survival, to at least avoid the seemingly unavoidable human catastrophe that looms like a near certainty on the horizon.

  • http://www.beforewisdom.com beforewisdom

    To the author of the article:

    I highly recommend that you read this post, by author Will Potter who writes about Corporate American working through the government to hurt the environmental and animal rights movements by using terms like you do in your title:

    “Calling the Discovery Channel Hostager Taker a “Radical Environmentalist” is Irresponsible and Inaccurate”

    http://www.greenisthenewred.com/blog/james-lee-not-radical-environmentalist/3094/

    • Kimitake Hiraoka

      Wow Michael, seems you’re copping it from both sides on this one. I thank you for your response to my post above, and while I do not agree with much of its content, I will resist the urge to engage you further on the matter. For now.

      But in the meantime, please allow me to handle this latest query.

      beforewisdom, that article you posted disputes the connection of the departed ‘extreme environmentalist’ to any environmentist movement. I must take issue with this.

      Firstly, the sentiments espoused by the poor chap – humans are bad, we must prioritise the well being of animals – are not entirely alien to the more extreme elements within the animal rights movement (which often masquerade as ‘environmentalists’).

      For instance, the founder of the Sea Shepherd ‘Conservation’ Society, often espouses similar rhetoric. He is openly misanthropic and has stated that he believes the life of an earthworm to be more valuable than a human life. He thinks the human species is a virus. He uses violence to carry out his agenda, claiming to do it in the name of “environmentalism”.

      So you see, there are distinct similarities here and this deluded fellow isn’t alone in his obscure beliefs. I suppose the only real difference is that this fellow was willing to put himself and his life on the line for his beliefs, while the other has chosen to put others in danger and to make himself rich in the process.

      But the underlying point is the same and I think to separate him from the broader misanthropic elements of the “environmental” movement is a false dichotomy.

    • David

      The article you link to seems to be saying becuase he wasn’t part of an organized group and because other environmentalists aren’t protesting against Discovery Channel that the term ‘radical environmentalist’ is wrong.

      radical – favoring drastic political, economic or social reforms

      environmentalist – any person who advocates or works to protect the air, water, animals, plants and other natural resources from pollution or its effects

      Seems to me that he met the definitions of the terms used and no part of the definitions require a group to be involved or for other people to agree with his position.

      So ‘Radical Environmentalist’ is an accurate description of him. He may also have been mentally disturbed but I don’t see how that would make the desciption any less true.

    • Michael Raymer

      It’s interesting, Kimitake, that you you would use comparative rhetoric in regards to this gunman and Paul Watson. I could make the same comparisons between Watson and you. Going with your claims, you both use deceit and pseudo-spin. You both ignore the facts to further your own causes. You both are fanatical in your pursuit of your own goals, without any regard to the opinions of others. And as far as deluded and obscure beliefs, you both stand on opposite ends of the same stage. So you see, you and Paul Watson are actually quite a bit alike.

  • http://www.beforewisdom.com beforewisdom

    @Kimitake Hiraoka;

    One quick point.

    I have seen Captain Watson speak a number of times. I agree with you that he makes statements in anger over the whale slaughter by the Japanese that make him look bad.

    However, the Sea Shephard society has never hurt anyone and they have a policy of not hurting anyone.

    The Japanese whalers, on the other hand, rammed the ship The Addy Gil, which was stationary and manned at the time. The Japanese whalers sank that ship and offered no assistance to the hands of The Addy Gil.

    • David

      The Ady Gil was not stationary at the time. The SSCS sunk the Ady Gil by improper towing. And the Japanese stood by to offer assistance, the SSCS said no thanks.

      • From MN, with hope…

        Well than how were they suppose to tow it Sherlock? Hm? They wouldn’t need to tow it if it hadn’t been rammed in the first place. They couldn’t tow it bow first because of the huge fricken hole in the bow where the nose used to be.

      • David

        Well to start Watson, when towing a much smaller vessel, especially backwards, you don’t use a long line because it tends to force the towed vessels stern underwater.

      • From MN, with hope…

        Maybe it was their only line strong enough, or maybe it was intended to be a prop fouler, hence it’s length. But it wasn’t trailing too far behind though. And the point on the Ady Gil where it was tied was almost at the waterline, and the point on the Bob Barker where it was tied was higher than the Ady Gil’s highest point. The ships wake, though, could have created an issue, and they were towing slowly, I think at 2-8 knots (don’t cite me on this, I really don’t know the number). Now, second?

        What a coincidence. I just realized they’re the same name, Capt. Paul and Sherlock’s assistant.

      • David

        So if they had let’s say a 100 foot rope you contend that they had to use 100 feet of rope? They couldn’t have cut the rope? Or tied it of at 50 feet?

        Sorry I denigrated the name of Dr Watson.

        They improperly towed it which could have been the ultimate cause of it sinking.

      • From MN, with hope…

        How were they supposed to tow it than, ‘all knowing’, and ‘all superior’ david? Stop avoiding my question, and tell us how it should have been towed. I don’t know why they used that rope. Ask one of them. Heck, ask Pete himself! He has a Facebook account.

        Oh, and I’m certain that if they had just left it adrift, and not try to save it that it would have miraculously stayed afloat, and the gaping hole in the bow would have patched itself. The ultimate demise of the Ady Gil was because the whole bow was sheared off by the Shonan Maru 2. They wouldn’t have had to tow it if the SM2 hadn’t rammed it.

      • David

        I already told you how they should have towed it. So stop accusing me of avoiding your question when the problem is with you.

        I don’t have a Facebook account so I guess I can’t ask Pete.

        If they had left it, I suspect the Nisshin Maru would have recovered it and they would have placed it in front of the IWC offices.

      • From MN, with hope…

        No you didn’t! You haven’t said a whisper about what they should have done! All you’d said is that they shouldn’t have towed it with a rope that long.

        Ask someone who does have a Facebook. They’re plentiful enough that someone you know has to have one.

        They wouldn’t have been able to recover it. The Nisshin doesn’t have a crane that would be able to recover it. It does have the winch system though, and they could tow it at the end of the slipway (probably underwater) since it can’t fit up the slipway. But why would they call off the whaling season to steal Sea Shepherd’s boat?

      • http://www.ecorazzi.com Michael d'Estries

        Everyone, I’m closing this thread due to the off-topic nature of the discussion.

      • David

        Try going back to my first comment from Sept 3rd. It is not rocket science to tow a damaged ship.

        Well now first it would fit up the slipway and if need be they could remove one or both pontoons. Second why would it stop the whaling season? Haven’t you seen pictures of the flensing deck of the Nisshin Maru? The Ady Gil would take up maybe 5%, probably less. And it would have definitely been worth it.

    • Kimitake Hiraoka

      beforewisdom, I’m afraid I’ll have to pull you up on a couple of things there. Firstly, a member of Paul Watson’s Sea Shepherd organisation was convicted to assaulting a member of the Japanese research crew with an acid projectile a few months ago. Tried and convicted in a court of law. That’s one example.

      This organisation rams ships, fires acid and chemically-tipped arrows and shines weapons-grade lasers into the eyes of civilian crews. They make no secret of it, their website will surely tell you as much. It is violence and if it took place in the territorial waters of a nation state, they would be arrested and charged. If it took place against the mariners of a non-passive country, the perpetrators would be blown out of the water by military force.

      As for Watson himself, he has been convicted of violent crimes. Norway 1997, for instance. Look into it. See if you can find anything about his tree-spiking days too. There’s a lot more to this character when you scratch beneath the surface. You’ll soon see he’s quite a nasty piece of work.

      As for the trimaran “collision”. Again, I think you may have been drinking the Sea Shepherd kool aid on this one too. See, there has not been a shred of evidence to show that the trimaran was rammed. In fact, investigations by the Australian and New Zealand maritime authorities have confirmed this. However, if you study the video evidence closely you will see that the trimaran accelerated into the path of the Shonan Maru 2 at the last moment, effectively ramming it.

      But what is more important here, I believe, is what the crew of the trimaran were doing up until the collision. They were engaged in acts of violence in the name of a fanatical agenda. Again, these thugs make no secret of it.

      Those who throw the acid call it “direct action”. Those who are burned by it call it “terrorism”. I suppose it’s a matter of perspective?

      • From MN, with hope…

        Yes, he was tried in the court of the country that supports the whaling industry, so you can’t call that a fair trial, in all reality. There is little evidence to show that the butyric acid is truly harmful.

        They haven’t ONCE shot off one of the chemically tipped arrows. They planned to, to soil the whale meat if the whaling fleet ever killed another whale in Sea Shepherd’s presence, but even if the Ady Gil wouldn’t have been rammed, than they wouldn’t have been needed. The acid is harmless. It can be harmful, but the stuff Sea Shepherd used wasn’t. Now again, you got your wish, and they aren’t using butyric acid anymore, so you can no longer cite that. Those weapons grade lasers cause the equivalent of a flashbulb, allegedly. Have we seen a sailor go overboard due to blindness? Have they complained of any blind whalers? No. The whalers use weapons-grade LRAD systems. Does Sea Shepherd whine about ‘weapons-grade’? No. And they have been committed in territorial waters(Libya), and nothing has happened. They haven’t rammed a ship recently. Besides, they do more damage to their own than the whalers. But I see the Bob Barker v Yushin Maru 3 as an accident, so leave that one out of it.

        Yes, he has indeed been convicted. But he’s not banned from any countries, and can travel freely. How about something from this century to cite.

        The small distance the Ady Gil moved forward, is negligible in the big picture. Sure, less damage would have been sustained if they hadn’t, but SM2 shouldn’t have been that close to begin with! They had little time to react, and they wanted to try and turn to starboard, but the AG doesn’t turn that well at slow speeds, so all it did was move forward. If they had done nothing at all than you would be ranting about how they did nothing to prevent the collision. And you are wrong, MNZs report says that fault lies heavily with the Shonan Maru 2. And your saying that it was justified helps prove the point that the SM2 rammed it intentionally. Personally, I’m not sure what they were trying to do, but I don’t think that they were trying to kill the AG crew.

        That is a fine line, and where it is depends on the onlooker. You, it appears, think that the line is waaaay over, near hanging banners. For me, I’m not sure where it is, but I am certain that they aren’t terrorists. Although I do thank you for not calling them terrorist in such a long time. It’s nice to see that.

      • Michael Raymer

        Good post MN, but we both know that you’re wasting your time. These guys know all this. They just want to start arguments and they know they don’t have a leg to stand on. So, they fabricate, they bend and twist, and they use lame semantic distinctions. Just once I’d like to see an SSCS crewman throw some orange juice so Kimitake and David could have a weep-fest over the dangers of citric ACID. And they can’t even call Pete Bethune by name anymore because they know that the Japanese court got played. PLAYED! Like a five dollar samisen. After all the jumping up and down and setting their own hair on fire, a few months ago, over a prison term that never materialized. PLAYED! And they want a separate weep-fest over ship ramming, disregarding the Yushin Maru 3′s deliberate ramming of the Bob Barker. Not to mention the fact that the Barker kept on with the mission while the Yushin immediately dropped back to change their underwear.

        I am sorry that SSCS is giving up on butyric acid. I think it was a good tactic and I really don’t care who wants to whine about it. If the whalers have that big of a problem with it, they can stay home.

      • David

        “Yes, he was tried in the court of the country that supports the whaling industry, so you can’t call that a fair trial, in all reality.”

        So the US supports the death penalty so any death penalty trial can’t be called a fair trial?

        You really need to work on your logic. Or better yet just say what you really meant. “I didn’t like the verdict so it MUST be wrong and the court MUST be unfair.” Isn’t that what almost every person found guilty in any court in any country says?

      • From MN, with hope…

        Well I call bogus on assault and knife possession, and I believe Pete when he says he threw the knife overboard after he cut the net(although climbing would have worked just as well). The capital punishment one is curious, and a bit of an issue here Stateside, but not as much as gay marriage, abortion, or the war. One way we could all be happy is if the evidence were to be presented to an indifferent court in a non-IWC country to see their verdict. That would be a better thing to do. Although I do see an issue on how Pete’s trial could be the equivalent of a US court issue based on capital punishment, aka the death sentence. (coincidentally the US and Japan are the two remaining countries in a group whose name I forget who still enforce the death penalty.) To the best of my knowledge it’s a different type of case, which would translate into a different type of court. And if I were to say what I meant, than… I would have said exactly what I said. Probably just not as polite.

      • David

        So I am sure you won’t be cheering when the NZ Maritime report becomes public, because obviously they are biased and some indifferent non-IWC country should do the investigation?

        Except too late for that, I have seen you cheering about what is supposed to be in their report for almost a week.

      • From MN, with hope…

        Is Sea Shepherd supported financially by the New Zealand government? No. Japan is biased because they support the whaling industry.

      • David

        So monetary support is the only thing that can cause bias? You really might want to do a little study on that topic.

      • From MN, with hope…

        Look, Japan’s government supports the whaling industry. That means, in turn, that they oppose the anti-whalers. New Zealand has no relations other than nationality and they’re the flag state of the sunken boat. Did they have a say in that? No. The Ady Gil was already registered as a New Zealand boat when it was the Earthrace, and a simple name change wouldn’t have caused entirely new paperwork. They couldn’t have done a thing about the volunteers nationality either. New Zealand had no say in their participation. They were just following procedure as well in investigating the SM2-AG incident. Japan totally signed up for this one on their own. New Zealand was singled out due to conditions that existed before the Earthrace even completed its run around the world.

      • David

        New Zealand opposes whaling. They have lodged numerous complaints against Japan for whaling. They joined with Australia to fund a rival research program just to try and prove (unsuccessfully) that Japan’s lethal research isn’t needed. And they have discussed joining Australia’s ICJ case against Japan. If you can’t see that all of that biases their actions then you have had far to much of the Kool Aid.

  • http://www.beforewisdom.com beforewisdom

    To the author of the article:

    Thanks for changing the title of the article, again :)

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