by Michael dEstries
Categories: Animals, Film/TV.
Photo: Animal Planet

Of all the programs that fall under the umbrella of Discovery Communications, Chief Operating Office Peter Liguori says “Whale Wars” is the one he’s most proud of.

Liguori, who was once a boss at the Fox Broadcasting Company, made the comments during the launch of Oprah’s new OWN network earlier this year. He admitted that the show brings an unusual amount of tension to not only television, but also for those filming what’s happening in the Southern Ocean this time of year. From the article:

These are tricky waters to navigate, Liguori admitted: On the one hand, Whale Wars makes for riveting television — “and this season is no different” — but on the other, Liguori is fearful of what might happen if events spiral out of control off Antarctica. Discovery Network is going through a period of unprecedented growth. Whale Wars is now one of the most-watched programs on the suddenly resurgent Animal Planet. Supervising a reality series from half a world away, where human lives are on the line, is considerably different from trailing a clan of tanned, toned-up, oversexed chowderheads from New Jersey, though.

“I really, really hope cooler heads will prevail,” Liguori told Postmedia News. “You have no idea how much I hope that. In a way, the whole situation is ridiculous. In a better world, none of this should need to happen.”

Check out the full article here. Whale Wars Season 4 is expected to hit Animal Planet sometime this summer.

About Michael dEstries

Michael has been blogging since 2005 on issues such as sustainability, renewable energy, philanthropy, and healthy living. He regularly contributes to a slew of publications, as well as consulting with companies looking to make an impact using the web and social media. He lives in Ithaca, NY with his family on an apple farm.

View all posts by Michael dEstries →
  • romika3

    Sorry, but Whale Wars validates eco-terrorism as a way to bring about change. Youth, who are on the “edge” may, in certain cases, see the SSCS has a legitimate conservation organization and therefore see their methods has an option.

    • Michael Raymer

      Youth? Hell, we’re seeing a lot of older people volunteering, including some grey hair. And SSCS methods are more than an “option”. It’s what’s happening right now. Let’s be clear on this. SSCS methods are shutting down whaling in the Southern Ocean Whale Sanctuary.

      • romika3

        Michael: You misinterpreted my comment. It has nothing to do with participation in the SSCS. What I am saying is that such a series incites violence and validates that violence is an ACCEPTABLE tool to bring about change. Unlike a violent TV show or movie where the viewer recognizes that it is only fiction.

      • Michael Raymer

        Yeah well, the wholesale rioting hasn’t commenced yet in my neighborhood, so I remain unfazed. And if the show sends any message, it is that there are issues that require direct action instead of prolonged political hand-wringing and apathy. Politicians are no substitute for the will of the people. And the whalers will not halt their activities in a place with no other enforcement, so it’s left to SSCS. I, and others, have said it many times: Show us an organization that gets better results than Sea Shepherd, and we’ll switch allegiance (the whales being the only true allegiance). No such organization as been forthcoming. Ending whaling is the only thing that is ACCEPTABLE.

      • Imforthewhales

        Sea Shepherd are in the southern ocean to stop the violence. The violence against the whales…the violence against protected whales in whale sanctuaries.

        I have not seen any violence except from the Japanese whalers when they tried to kill the Ady Gil crew and whenever they attempt to knock people into the freezing water with their water cannons or use their flash bombs indiscriminately against SSCS crew.

        Sea Shepherd has never hurt anyone…nor do they ever attempt to hurt anyone…therefore your claims of violence are false.

        SSCS are there to stop the whale violence.

        Could there be anything more non violent and altruistic than that?

    • AnimuX

      Unfortunately, pro-whaling antagonists and industry fronts continue to misuse the word “terrorism” in order to evoke an emotional response. They continue to demonize activists who have NEVER (actually or threatened) killed anyone, beaten anyone up, or taken anyone hostage by falsely comparing them to real terrorists who have killed thousands of innocent people. They do this in order to erode support for environmental causes and protest against the cruel and exploitative industries they represent.

      For example, romika3 is an admitted Canadian baby seal skull basher who has been the subject of protest as well.

      • crumpets are yummy.

        When did saving lives become eco-terrorism?

    • whiplash

      Eco-terrorsim? LOL Straight out of the ICR propaganda booklet that one is. Oh wait, you might be a Glenn Inwood / Whaling puppet yourself. Where is that Greenpeace ship when you need it?

    • WhiteWizard

      You are a paid troll for the Japanese Whalers. Go spread your mis-information elsewhere.

  • romika3

    “Liguori, who was once a boss at the Fox Broadcasting Company” now I know why there is a “Whale Wars”!!!!

  • Mick

    Liguori said, “In a better world, none of this should need to happen.”

    He’s got that right. In a better world slimey TV executives would not promote violence against innocent people in order to make a few bucks.

    • Michael Raymer

      Yeah, but they are…and it’s working.

      http://www.seashepherd.org/news-and-media/news-110110-1.html

      http://www.seashepherd.org/news-and-media/news-110109-1.html

      “Today marks the eleventh day since Sea Shepherd successfully located the Japanese whaling fleet before they could begin whaling. During this time, the Yushin Maru No. 2 and Yushin Maru No. 3 have been unable to fire single harpoon. The Yushin Maru No. 1 is presumably with the Nisshin Maru fleeing westward. A fishing vessel sighted them on January 9th relaying their position to Sea Shepherd. Considering the distance the Yushin Maru has covered during the last eleven days, the speed at which they are traveling, and the fact they only have one harpoon vessel with them, the chances of them whaling are low, and if any whaling has taken place, it will be minimal.”

      “The Sea Shepherd vessels the Bob Barker and Steve Irwin carry physicians, trained medics, and firemen, and have well-stocked medical wards. The ships carry emergency pumps, firefighting equipment, and towing equipment.”

      Sounds like business is good.

    • Imforthewhales

      In a better world the whalers would go back home and stay home.

  • AnimuX

    “In a better world, none of this should need to happen.”

    Indeed. If Japan and other whaling nations had not violated and subverted international whaling regulations and conservation efforts then many endangered species of whales would not be endangered today.

    There might not have ever been a need for a “Save the Whales” movement if world industries had not purposely driven nearly every large species of whale to the brink of extinction while ignoring warnings from scientists and environmentalists alike.

    If only the government of Japan honored its international obligations rather than protecting the interests of entrenched bureaucrats (amakudari) who often leave their public positions to take high paid jobs in the whaling industry they once oversaw.

    If only the other world governments who voted to enact a moratorium on whaling and repeatedly called for Japan to stop killing whales would take steps to enforce their own resolutions.

    Then perhaps NGOs wouldn’t have to act like watch dogs and guard dogs in order to physically protect whales that are already protected by international conventions.

  • http://www.thewhalepeople.com thewhalepeople.com

    With the Wikileaks from this past week, it has become openly clear the lip service aid by all governments who say they are against whaling or any form of it. So it is no surprise that NGOs have to come forward and DO something.

    Diplomacy behind closed door, who is in who’s pocket and what profit can be made. Japan pays no heed to any country. They have the U.S. sewn up in their pocket. Big name movie stars (on the other side of the coin) don’t come forward to take on the cause. Why? Well, check out Japanese YOUTUBE and you’ll see the millions they make to sell beer, facial tissues and soup.

    And you have a country (japan) that openly pollutes the water and the air, who bribes Russian officials to look the other way with their fishing trawlers, who take whale meat as gifts and has 6,000 tons of frozen whale meat.

    They don’t care and their motive is their culture and their profit.

    The Sea of Japan is pretty well depleted of the fish they eat. Well, go to Russian waters, go to Antarctica. And if there are laws, break them. Or use loop holes. Yes, there are those out there who can say the Japanese are operating within the letter of the law. But are they really?

    They are happy to drag their feet and complain about people who disagree with them. They will play with words like sustainable, when in fact they really don’t care.

    I applaud Sea Shepherd. Goodness know, somebody is doing something about our seas.

  • crumpets are yummy.

    Wikileaks has revealed that the Japanese government views Sea Shepherd Conservation Society as a very serious threat to their illegal whaling activities. In a classified U.S. Department of State document released by Wikileaks to the El Pais newspaper in Spain, the Japanese Deputy General Director for the Japanese Fisheries Agency Mr. Yamashita, pointed out that “the harassment of the Sea Shepherd Conservation Society had kept the Japanese whaling fleet from reaching its quotas these last few years.”

    Sea Shepherd is defending a whale sanctuary whereas the whalers are slaughtering whales in a whale sanctuary. Sea Shepherd is taking every precaution to not injure any of the whalers yet the whalers are intent upon causing bodily harm to Sea Shepherd’s crewmembers.

    The whalers are involved in bribery scandals, vote buying, and corruption.

    Sea Shepherd continues to implement a campaign of intervention against illegal whaling operations in the Southern Ocean Whale Sanctuary, while exercising extreme caution not to cause bodily harm to any whaler and not to violate any international laws. Sea Shepherd has not committed a crime. Sea Shepherd has not been charged with committing a crime and Sea Shepherd has no intention of committing a crime.

    The Japanese whaling industry is conducting criminal operations by targeting endangered and protected whales inside the boundaries of an established international whale sanctuary. They are also in violation of a global moratorium on commercial whaling by using subterfuge to claim their whaling is “scientific,” all while utilizing bribery to secure the necessary votes to support their bogus claims.

    If Japan’s accusation that Sea Shepherd’s are “pirates and eco-terrorists” are to be believed, then these questions must be asked: How is it that Sea Shepherd’s ships can use New Zealand and Australian ports but the Japanese whalers are banned from entry into Australian and New Zealand ports?

    How is it that none of the SSCS officers nor PW have been charged for intervention and interference with Japanese whaling? How is it that the Dutch government has not reprimanded the SSCS Dutch registered ships, and the Australian government has not reprimanded the SSCS Australian flagged ship? Why would Australia give the Gojira a flag if they considered the SSCS “pirates and eco-terrorists?”

    Unfortunately for the whalers, the whale wars series is a huge success and is getting the message across to the world that the Japanese whalers should not be there, that the whalers will stop at nothing to get what they want, use violent tactics against SSCS and the whales and they need to go home.

  • Mick

    “Liguori is fearful of what might happen if events spiral out of control off Antarctica”

    Of course, there would be no reason for him to be “fearful” if he was not promoting and helping to finance violent eco-terrorists lead by an mentally unstable pathological liar with a fragile ego.

    There would also be far less reason for him to worry if Animal Planet and Discovery Channel executives were not goading SS into committing increasingly dangerous stunts in order to boost ratings for a TV show.

    • Michael Raymer

      “if Animal Planet and Discovery Channel executives were not goading SS into committing increasingly dangerous stunts in order to boost ratings for a TV show.” OK, I want proof of this, I want definitive proof and I want it now. Show us where AP and/or DC is interferring with or altering how SSCS conducts business on their campaigns. Please post documentation, links and quotes. This is a very serious accusation, bordering on libel and since you seem to make it with conviction, show proof. And if you don’t show proof, I hope you don’t mind if I piggy-back every post you make with a demonstration of your deceit and desire to make patent lies on a public forum. The same type of lies that you accuse Admiral Watson of making without ever showing proof there, either.

      • crumpets are yummy.

        Come on Mick…cough up.

        tick tick tick tick tick tick….

      • romike3

        Being in from of a camera that is gathering footage for a series that is meant to show violence will push the preformers to take risk.

      • Michael Raymer

        “will push the preformers to take risk.” You’ve had three years to prove that point and you have failed miserably. Nothing of the sort has happened and nothing of the sort is currently happening.

        How does it feel to always be wrong?

    • josh lamb

      Animal planet pays SS 0$ for there taping. I think they pay them a small fee for food and space.

  • Mike

    The primary species of whale that Japan seeks to harvest, the minke whale, is considered the ‘rabbit of the sea’ and numbers many hundred of thousand, of which the Japanese wish to harvest about a thousand. Not to mention the whale eating nations elsewhere in the world who harvest sustainably. By any means of harvesting either animal or plant protein, the species targeted for harvesting is totally sustainable. The rest is simply imposing one values on others – some people like to eat whale meat and can do so sustainably. One may not agree on the method of slaughter (but then again animals are killed by many cultures that other considered unacceptable) but there is absolutely no threat to the species and no threat that whale meat eating is going to becoming super popular. The Discovery channel only stirs the pot until some one (other than the whales) get gets killed – but that in their view is worth the value of viewers to the Discovery channel for the enormous sums of money made from the ads. The Discovery exec becomes rich whilst sooner or latter people will die for the program and he will of course deny that he has blood on his hands. No one who made their fortune in the likes of the Fox network is known for seeking harmony.

    • Michael Raymer

      ” The Discovery channel only stirs the pot until some one (other than the whales) get gets killed”

      Again, where is your proof? Show it to us or quit making baseless accusations.

      You guys just make shit up as you go, don’t you?

  • Mick

    @Michael Raymer

    “OK, I want proof of this”

    Sure thing, Michael. Just as soon as you provide proof that hurling glass bottles of chemicals and flares and attempting to disable ships at sea is legal. Show everyone the law that says those things or legal.
    Prove that watson is a licensed captain, let alone an “admiral”. Where did he obtain his license? What legal authority issued his license? What school or institution did he attend in order to gain his captain’s credentials?

    • Michael Raymer

      No, no, no. You made the accusation, now you can’t back it up. You are not going to change the subject. I want proof of your accusation, “Animal Planet and Discovery Channel executives are goading SS into committing increasingly dangerous stunts in order to boost ratings for a TV show.” Show the proof or shut up. Like I said above, you guys just make shit up as you go, hoping the casual viewer will believe your ongoing line of crap. It hasn’t been working, and it’s not going to work. For one thing, this isn’t about Admiral Watson. So why are you trying to twist the debate to him? You accused ANIMAL PLANET and DISCOVERY CHANNEL. That is who this topic is about. You made another one of your crap accusations, and you have no proof, which makes you a liar and fabricator.

      Keep posting Mick. I’m going to keep beating you over the head with this.

      • Mick

        @Michael Raymer

        “I want proof of your accusation”

        Sure. Just as soon as you provide proof to back up YOUR claims. Claims that you, other SS supporters and SS has been making for YEARS. You people routinely make outrageous claims and accusations without a shred of proof. Yet you DEMAND that others provide proof of their statements, like a spoiled child. Your leader, watson, TELLS his supporters to lie and make things up. Yet YOU have the gall to call others “a liar and fabricator.” What self-important tripe!
        So, Michael, you can start by PROVING that watson is a licensed captain.

      • Michael Raymer

        This thread is not about whether Watson is a captain. The topic of this thread is about an AP execs feelings towards a show that is on their channel. You made the accusation that AP and Discovery Communications were interfering with how SSCS conducts their operations. I want proof, and until I get it, or a retraction, I’m going to keep identifying you for the lying sack of crap that you are. I didn’t ask you to make your bullshit claim. You did that all by yourself. And since you have no response, other than to go waaay off topic, you make it clear that you are a liar for making a false claim, and a fool for trying to get away with it. That’s all that needs to be said. Your credibility is shot. Every word you post from here on out is nothing more than a turd in a punchbowl.

        So now doofus, let’s talk about Watson. If he isn’t the captain of the ‘Steve Irwin’, who is? Who is giving the orders that the rest of the crew follows? Who gives the orders that the other two ships carry out? Tell me doofus, who is giving the orders? When you have your answer, you will have mine: That’s who the captain is. What “license” is needed to run the ‘Steve Irwin’? Tell me, expert. What “license” is needed to pull into any port, to leave any port and to conduct anti-whaling operations on a non-commercial maritime vessel? Are you going to answer, or change the subject again? How is this “license” issue keeping Admiral Watson from kicking your punk buddies asses all over the Antarctic? Let’s hear it!

      • Michael Raymer

        And by the way Mick, I never claimed or gave a damn about Watson having a license. So you are calling me a liar for something I never said or even thought. This is why I’m so comfortable calling you a fool and a doofus. Not only can you not back yourself up on a point that you brought up, but now you’re making shit up as to what others are saying.

        You are quite the pathetic piece of work, aren’t you?

  • john

    Mick, the law doesn’t mandate what is right and wrong. If we always obeyed it, there would be little, if any, resistance against oppression. The main point is that Sea Shepherd is not hurting anybody and never aims to – unlike the whalers which have set themselves a target of around 1000 bodies of sentient beings.

    • David

      “The main point is that Sea Shepherd is not hurting anybody and never aims to”

      Just how can you make that claim when they throw glass bottles and flares where people are standing?

      “…around 1000 bodies of sentient beings.”

      And there are tens of thousands of sentient beings killed every day around the world for food. Why should non-endangered whales any be given special status?

      • crumpets are yummy.

        Are fin whales off the endangered list David?

      • AnimuX

        What about the 100 endangered Sei whales Japan kills annually in the North Pacific?

      • john

        David, do people in Japan, a first world country, need to eat these whales to survive? Of course not. In which case just leave them alone. You’re using a slippery slope to try to justify exploiting anything that you can, because you like the taste of whale meat. Anyway I’m not going to bother arguing with troll for Glenn Inwood.

      • David

        john, do people in the USA, need to eat apples to survive? Of course not. In which case just leave them alone.

        You try and use a completely ignorant argument. But I guess when you don’t have anything else and refuse to even try and defend your position, then ignorance is your only refuge.

        Maybe the SSCS will still give you your check for the attempted trolling.

      • Michael Raymer

        “john, do people in the USA, need to eat apples to survive?”

        Boy, what a stoopid question. Of course we need apples. The are a basic food staple with vitamins and minerals that promote good health. Those who wear dunce-caps for a living may have never heard, “An apple a day keeps the doctor away”, but those of us who take pride in our education have.

        Sheesh, some people improve with age. David and Mick….don’t.

    • David

      Gee some people really have reading comprehension problems.

      I specifically asked the question about the non-endangered whales that Japan hunts. I did not say all the whales Japan hunts are non-endangered, because I know they are not, that is why I specified the subgroup in my question.

      Now since you seem to want to speak for john, why don’t you answer the question rather than continue to show you inability to read English?

      • Michael Raymer

        And David keeps wanting to ignore the barbaric cruelty that goes into killing an intelligent species. He doesn’t care at all about the pain that is felt by others. Money, money, money. If someone is getting paid from it, David and his type couldn’t care less about suffering. And if killing baby whales makes killing the parents that much easier, then that is just fine with him too. Easy money is better than difficult money, isn’t it David? And as long as it’s someone else that has to do the suffering, what do you care?

      • David

        Yes Michael easy money is better than difficult money. With everything else being equal I would rather work 40 hours in a climate controlled building rather than 60 hours outside in all kinds of weather to make the same amount of money, and I think most people feel the same way.

        And you are wrong, I do care about suffering. I believe that when humans use animals for food the animals should be killed as humanely as possible. And guess what? The experts at the IWC have said that the penthrite grenade with a large calibre rifle, if needed, is the most humane way to kill a whale.

        Of course what my beliefs have to do with the whaling debate is beyond me. I guess it is just an attempt to divert the discussion and/or some come of ad hominem attack.

      • Michael Raymer

        “The experts at the IWC have said….”

        You are just a laugh a minute. I’m sure that these methods are the most humane method available. That doesn’t make them humane. It just means it’s better than a pointy stick. It still takes way too long, and with too much suffering to be condoned.

      • crumpets are yummy.

        Which method would you prefer on yourself David?

        Would the pointy stick be your preference?

  • Jane

    According to the cites treaty, and japan signed it, there is to be NO commercial activity below the 60th parallel. This is to protect antarctica from total exploitation by all nations. Japan is clearly, and by any definition, breaking the law. Why should Japan be the exception and be above the law. If the law should not apply, why not just let anyone use this area any way they want? We could dump nuclear waste, drill for oil without any pesky environmental regulation, fish out any species that lives or spawns the re, anything anyone wants, a free for all, unhindered by any sort of protection. Why a pass for the Japanese, only? Ss IS a legitimite conservation org. The Japanese whalers are the lawbreakers and pirates. Why do

    • David

      The CITES treaty has nothing to do with Antarctica and the 60th parallel.

      You are probably thinking of the Antarctic Treaty, and it does not say no commercial activity below the 60th parallel. In fact it specifically doesn’t apply to hunting in the waters around Antarctica, although it does not allow dumping of nuclear waste or drilling for oil. And CCAMLR regulates fishing in the ATS area, while the IWC is responsible for whales.

    • whiplash

      It will be illegal for the Nisshin Maru to enter this area as from August this year due to new laws coming into effect relating to use of “Heavy oil”. This could be the death knell the whaling industry needs (as if there isn’t enough already!).

  • Jane

    Why dont the Japanese go home and fish their own waters to extinction? Why does anyone think they have the right to exclusively exploit a resource that belongs to all countries in general and specifically within the jurisdiction of Austrailia. I have not even mentioned the sentience of the whales as a factor.

    • David

      It is not within the jurisdiction of Australia. And they don’t think they have an exclusive right, any country that wants to send ships down there to hunt whales.

      • Michael Raymer

        Hunt whales, hunt whalers. What’s the difference? Oh yeah, the whales can’t defend themselves.

        How many whales have your boyz pulled in so far this year, David?

      • crumpets are yummy.

        probably zero?

      • David

        Well Michael it is pretty simple. Hunting whales is legal. Hunting whalers is illegal.

        And I have no idea how many whales they have killed this year.

      • Michael Raymer

        Hunting whalers is illegal? Wow! Sounds like a problem. Maybe you should send someone to the Southern Ocean Whale Sanctuary, to arrest Admiral Watson. I have it on good authority that he is down there, hunting whalers as we speak. In fact, he has been doing so for a number of years now. Whaddya think about that?

      • crumpets are yummy.

        I am glad David that you agree that hunting whales is illegal.

  • Jane

    you might have misread. What is your background and area of expertise? So, it is okay with you that Japan should have the one and only exclusive right to whale in a whale sanctuary. Do you think you could promote me for an exclusive on wildlife refuges? Think of the money we could make and we would be affirming the culture of the pioneers. We could take elephants, eagles, anything, strictly for science you know. I want to know if ivory has changed and if tigers still eat meat.

    • David

      Japan doesn’t have “the one and only exclusive right to whale in a whale sanctuary”. Any country that wants to can whale exactly where the Japanese are whaling. What is about that simple fact that you don’t understand?

      Explain to me why my background and area of expertise is important to the discussion and why haven’t you given your background and area of expertise?

  • Michael Raymer

    “Any country that wants to can whale exactly where the Japanese are whaling.”

    So why don’t they? Why are the Japanese the only ones who conduct whaling operations in the Southern Ocean Whale Sanctuary?

    • David

      Well I see Michael needs simple things explained to him, again.

      Other countries don’t because they don’t want to, but if they did want to they could. See it really is simple. I don’t know why you can’t understand plainly worded English sentences.

      • Michael Raymer

        OK, well since it’s so simple, how about doing a simple job explaining why other countries don’t kill whales in the Antarctic. You just said that they can. Why don’t they? I mean, if whales are so plentiful, you’d think that everyone would be getting in on this. Explain why they’re not. You like to go on about cow, chickens, and the oh so intelligent pig. The Japanese make use of these animals like the rest of the world does. Why doesn’t the rest of the world kill whales like the Japanese do?

    • David

      Are you really that dense?

      I told you why, BECAUSE THEY DON’T WANT TO.

      People in the Netehrlands kill and eat horse, why don’t people in the USA kill and eat horse? Simple because they don’t want to.

      No other country wants to send ships to the Antarctic to hunt whales. It is that simple. Your inability to figure that out yourself and then your inability to understand when specifically told that is scary.

      • Michael Raymer

        You’re saying that they don’t want to. I’m asking, why don’t they want too? I really want to understand this. It’s you guys going on and on about how we can kill so many more whales, how wonderful a meal it makes, how everyone should be able to go to the store and pick up a pound of whale meat. So, I’d like to know why more countries haven’t signed on to this great food source that you are so passionate about. A recent poll said that 83% of Americans want President Obama to “use his power to help strengthen the international ban on commercial whaling.” I’m one of them. So tell me, what are we missing? Why don’t Americans, with all our guns and our willingness to use them, head down to the Antarctic to kill whales? I’m sure you can give us some poignant insight into why this is.

    • David

      Ah, no I understand. You have decided to lie again in an vain attempt to make some kind of stupid point.

      I never said whale makes a wonderful meal. I never said everyone should be able to go to the store and pick up a pound of whale meat. You are just lying, typical paid SSCS troll behavior.

      “I’m sure you can give us some poignant insight into why this is.”

      Most countries never hunted whales for food; they hunted them mainly for oil, with a few other minor resources. Replacements for oil and those resources have been found that are as good or better and as cheap or cheaper. That leaves meat as the only reason to hunt whales and most countries have no market for whale meat and thus no incentive to hunt whales.

      There are a few countries where there may be a market for whale meat yet they don’t hunt whales, like South Korea. This is most likely because of undesirable political and trade fallout if they started hunting whales. Japan isn’t as worried about this due to their perception that they can withstand the fallout, whereas smaller countries/economies may not be able to withstand the fallout. Although South Korea does seem to have a lot of bycatch of whales, which they allow to be sold.

      • Michael Raymer

        ” You are just lying, typical paid SSCS troll behavior.”

        I have stated for the record several times that I have never received any money from SSCS or any other organization. You say that I’m stupid, yet you ignorantly keep making the same false point.

        And you, ignorantly, refuse to answer my question. I didn’t ask about Japan, I didn’t ask about South Korea. I didn’t ask about countries that consume whale meat. I asked about countries that DON”T consume whale meat, which is the vast majority. Again, in an attempt to bore through the thickness of your skull, why aren’t other countries, especially the ones who have severe hunger issues, hopping on down to the Antarctic and cashing in on this wonderful food source of yours?

        You’re the one that comes in here day after week after month, defending the indefensible. You’re the one that would rather see whales in the freezer than in the ocean. You’re the one that thinks that if there are just enough animals to not be endangered, they should be immediately killed and eaten. So, why aren’t more people eating whale if, according to you, it’s such a great idea.

        For a guy who likes to go around calling everyone else stupid, you sure have a hard time answering direct questions. (Not to mention all the posts above that you and butt-buddy Mick have failed to respond too)

      • Annonymous2

        @Michael Raymer

        In another thread you apologized for calling someone your “gay” son now you resort to calling Mick – “butt-buddy”.

        While discussions may get heated, when you resort to name calling — you have lost the debate.

        Obviously no one at ecorazzi monitors any of these threads and offensive language like yours is allowed so I will never be back.

      • Michael Raymer

        ‘Kay. Bye.

      • David

        “I have stated for the record several times that I have never received any money from SSCS or any other organization. You say that I’m stupid, yet you ignorantly keep making the same false point.”

        Well since you are a proven liar, I chose not to believe you. So just keep cashing those SSCS checks.

        And more ignorance. The whole 4th paragraph answers your question, but you are just to ignorant to understand. So again I will have to repeat myself, maybe if I capitalize it you will understand better.
        MOST COUNTRIES HAVE NO MARKET FOR WHALE MEAT AND THUS NO INCENTIVE TO HUNT WHALES.

        “You’re the one that would rather see whales in the freezer than in the ocean.”

        Another lie by Michael.

        “You’re the one that thinks that if there are just enough animals to not be endangered, they should be immediately killed and eaten.”

        Another lie by Michael.

        “Not to mention all the posts above that you and butt-buddy Mick have failed to respond too.”

        And now Michael is The Inquisition and everyone must answer his questions on pain of ad hominem attack.

      • Michael Raymer

        Show me where I have lied. I have not. You choose not to believe me? Who cares? But go ahead and contact SSCS in Friday Harbor, WA and ask them if they have ever heard of me. Their phone number is 360-370-5650.

        As far as this ridiculous sub-thread that we have engaged in….GOTCHA!! I knew what you were saying in your first post. I just thought I’d lead you down the same garden path of obfuscation, distortion and horseshit that you are so fond of leading others down. And you fell for it. I knew that if I kept typing, you’d keep responding. See how irritating it is? Start conducting yourself in a constructive, rational manner and I’ll stop making you my biotch.

        “And now Michael is The Inquisition and everyone must answer his questions on pain of ad hominem attack.”

        Well, that’s one way of looking at it. I just find it amusing that you, Mick and Matt show up, spread some vitriol and then either haul ass or change the subject when you get backed into a corner. My current dialogue with Mick shows this with stunning clarity. You guys really aren’t very good at this, are you? But, don’t worry. As I predict in my post below (January 12, 2011 at 8:52 pm), you guys have, at best, 14 more months. After that, there will be no more Antarctic whaling fleet. Better cash those ICR paychecks as soon as you get them. The money might not always be there.

      • David

        I have shown a number of your lies just in my past few posts.

        And you have shown that you aren’t here to discuss the situation but to troll, I mean you just admitted it, can’t get much more stupid than that.

        What does the SSCS list your checks as, PR, consultant?

      • Michael Raymer

        Sometimes it takes a thief to catch a thief and it takes a troll to catch a troll. You and your boyz decided to set the tone for these debates. I’m just coming along for the ride. My posting history is there for everyone to see. Keep it constructive and I will remain so. Devolve the conversation to your usual brand of mud slinging and I’ll be happy to lower myself to your level. It’s not like you could ever reach mine.

  • http://www.themutznuts.com/ MutzNuts

    wow this is better than celebrity boxing, I read all of that in the veil hope that Mike would provide some proof to backup the claims but unsurprisingly none has appeared nor do i think it will, but please feel free to just make some up, would fit with your current postings well.

    Oh and can you tell me where i sign up for the Sea Shepherd Troll campaign because i have only been posting pro SSCS comments and posts and never got paid once, i feel like i am missing out now

  • William

    SCSS is enforcing an international ban on whaling, simple as that. The Japanese think they can get away with exploting a loophole that allows a limited amount of whaling for ‘research’ and yet they haven’t produced any. There’s a reason for that…

    There are a good half-dozen international and national laws SCSS operates under, most important of which, the UN World Charter for Nature which allows private citizens to enforce the charter.

    As for throwing glass bottles, this is getting really funny. First people complain about non-toxic ‘acid’ that’s basically rotten butter, so they replace it with actual rotten butter and now you complain about the bottle since you can’t use the word ‘acid’ for the contents? Awesome. :)

    So explosive harpoons and elevenths guns being shot at whales, intelligent self-aware creatures is acceptable? No.

    • David

      The SSCS has no authority to enforce anything.

      You may want to look at the definition of loophole. It means that unless the law is changed the action is legal.

      And there are hundreds of peer reviewed papers that have been produced. Even the IWC SC has said that the data the Japanese have given them has been useful.

      The UN WCfN does not allow private citizens to enforce the charter.

      • Michael Raymer

        “And there are hundreds of peer reviewed papers that have been produced.”

        No there aren’t.

        http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0CSA0WuQzmQ

      • http://www.facebook.com/people/Josh-Lamb/100000872581980 Josh Lamb

        Holy crap David, 4 somewhat relevent papers that are useful. haha, love that video

      • David

        And how old is that video?

        And even if the video didn’t have a predetermined outcome they still admit 4 relevant papers, So I guess they have done some research. Thanks for admitting it.

      • Michael Raymer

        “And how old is that video?”

        Seriously? Seriously! This is the question you’re asking? This coming from the people who keep dredging up a 30 year old interview. Do you realize that I’m laughing at you? I sincerely hope, David, that you are looking both ways before crossing the street. I would be bereft and forlorn if anything was to happen to you that would stop you from posting here. You do more for the anti-whaling cause than I could ever hope too. Take your vitamins and keep up the good work.

      • David

        So more lies by the proven liar, why am I not surprised. I don’t know what 30 year old interview you are talking about but I have never dredged it up.

        Do you get paid per post or per lie?

      • Michael Raymer

        “So more lies by the proven liar”

        Where in my last post did I lie David? Do you think that I’m lying when I say I’m laughing at you? I’m not. So, where is the lie? Tell me David (aka Wormtongue).

        Do you have anything to say anymore or should we just get used to this pathetic flailing about of yours? You used to be a worthy adversary. Lately you have been more like PeeWee Herman trying to spar with Mike Tyson. I understand that you are under a lot of pressure, what with your boyz being issued an ass-kicking of biblical proportions by SSCS. I understand what the spectre of crushing, humiliating defeat can do to a person. May I get you a damp towel? Some warm soy milk with a dash of nutmeg, perhaps? What will you do David, when the whalers go broke, the ICR goes out of business, and no one with a harpoon dares go anywhere near the Southern Ocean Whale Sanctuary for fear of yet another ass-kicking?

        You have kept up to date, have you not? The whalers supply ship has been blockaded. When the whaling ships run out of fuel, their filling station won’t be there for them. If they have had any time at all to whale in the last couple of weeks (which is doubtful), they won’t be able to transfer the tiny amount of whale meat that they MAY have to the transport/reefer ship. Oh no!

        How long do you think this is going to continue? One more season? Maybe an outside chance a two more seasons? How much more of this punishment are your resolute and resolved whalers going to take before they bow to the inevitable?

      • David

        Well unless you can dredge up where I referenced some 30 year old interview, you lie by saying that I had.

        It really is getting boring explaining simple things to paid admitted trolls.

      • Michael Raymer

        http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H_gTBDFTXE0

        “This coming from THE PEOPLE who keep dredging up a 30 year old interview.”

        Unfortunately, Ecorazzi.com does not lend itself to easily going through previous posts on past threads. And considering how well the Whale Wars are going, I don’t see how YOU rate this much effort. I’m confident that you, yourself have referenced this interview in the past. If you haven’t, well then I’m wrong. I’ll get over it. Your side of the debate, however, has referenced it as nauseum. And you are well aware of that. So it is hypocritical to ask about the date on what is obviously a much more recent finding.

        As long as you keep making the groundless accusation that SSCS has paid me in any way, my guilt over possibly being wrong about you referencing this interview will remain tepid at best.

      • David

        “So it is hypocritical to ask about the date on what is obviously a much more recent finding.”

        No it is not. If I never made mention of this 30 year old video then it is not hypocritical of me to ask about the date of your video.

        Do they pay you extra for posting on weekends and holidays?

      • Michael Raymer

        David, are you here to debate whaling or just to swing at me? The line gets blurred.

        To answer your question, which you should have answered for yourself, the video was released the week of 8/6/2006.
        http://www.abc.net.au/catalyst/stories/s1657789.htm

        Quotes from the narrative:

        “Prof Archer: Alright, that’s it. And from that whole pile of papers we’ve got a total of one, two, three, four papers that can be said to be peer reviewed, that have some relevance to developing or managing a whaling industry and also would require lethal sampling of whales to get that information. Just four papers.”

        “Nick Gales: So with the eighteen year program and sixty eight hundred whales divided by four papers – that means 1700 whales killed for each one of those four papers.”

        “Mike Archer: Extremely depressing.
        Nick Gales: IT WOULDN’T PASS AN ETHICS COMMITTEE. Archer: No it would not.” (emphasis is mine, but quoted directly from text)

        OK David, was there anything else I can clear up for you? Is this the point where you suggest that the ICR started doing legitimate research only AFTER this program was aired? Exactly what point
        would you like to make, at this juncture?

        Do you actually think you are getting anywhere with this? Do you think that the casual onlooker is coming here and making their own determination because you can’t find the production date? Do you think that people are telling themselves to take their kids college funds and donate to the ICR because you keep accusing me of getting paid, which I’m not? What exactly do you think you are accomplishing here?

        After proofreading this the thought occurs to me: Maybe I should get paid for this. And extra pay for weekends would be SWEET!

      • David

        The ICR accepts donations? Really? Where do I go to do that?

        No the ICR has been doing real research since day one, a fact that the IWC Scientific Committee agrees on.

        So the video shows two admittedly bias scientists and one scientist with an unknown view on whaling. They review over 10 years of papers in one day, many of them in disciplines that none of the three have any background in. That sure sounds definitive.

      • Michael Raymer

        That’s a really cogent rebuttal, coming from a guy who couldn’t find the broadcast date. You don’t know how to use a search engine, but you can question the qualifications of the panel on the video? Nope, not doing it for me.

        Since I provided the information you asked for, please show me where the IWC Scientific Committee thinks that these ridiculous papers have scientific validity. Since you seem to have a problem using your own computer, I’ll help with the first step:

        http://iwcoffice.org/sci_com/handbook.htm

        I see ONE line:
        “JR – JARPN II Review – Revised JARPN II review papers and response papers ”

        That’s all I see on the Scientific Committee page.

        But wait, there’s more:

        http://www.iwcoffice.org/meetings/resolutions/Resolution2007-1.pdf

        Y’know, I was going to excerpt this but screw it, here’s the whole thing:

        RESOLUTION ON JARPA

        WHEREAS paragraph 7(b) of the Schedule establishes a sanctuary in the Southern Ocean;

        RECALLING that the Commission has repeatedly requested Contracting Parties to refrain from issuing special permits for research involving the killing of whales within the Southern Ocean Sanctuary, has expressed deep concern at continuing lethal research within the Southern Ocean Sanctuary, and has also recommended that scientific research involving the killing of cetaceans should only be permitted where critically important research needs are addressed;

        CONSCIOUS that the Scientific Committee last year convened a workshop to analyse the results of JARPA 1, which is reported in SC/59/REP 1;
        NOTING that the Workshop agreed that none of the goals of JARPA 1 had been reached, and that the results of the JARPA 1 programme are not required for management under the RMP;

        FURTHER NOTING that the Government of Japan has authorised a new special permit programme in the Antarctic, JARPA II, in which the take of minke whales has been more than doubled, and fin whales and humpback whales have been added to the list of targeted species;

        CONCERNED that fin whales in the Southern Hemisphere are currently classified as endangered, and that humpback whales in the JARPA II research area may include individuals from depleted breeding populations overwintering in the waters of certain Pacific Islands;

        CONVINCED that the aims of JARPA II do not address critically important research needs;

        NOW THEREFORE THE COMMISSION
        CALLS UPON the Government of Japan to address the 31 recommendations listed in Appendix 4 of Annex O of the Scientific Committee report relating to the December 2006 review of the JARPA I programme to the satisfaction of the Scientific Committee;

        FURTHER CALLS UPON the Government of Japan to suspend indefinitely the lethal aspects of JARPA II conducted within the Southern Ocean Whale Sanctuary.

        Catch that last line, David? This is from the same IWC that you INSIST on hanging your hat on. And they want your whalers to go home too!

      • David

        I have known the date of the video since the first time I saw it almost 3 years ago. And thanks for admitting my cogent rebuttal.

        You still need to work on that reading comprehension. I did not say that the ICR SC thinks these papers have scientific validity, although I am sure they do. What I said is “No the ICR has been doing real research since day one, a fact that the IWC Scientific Committee agrees on.” No mention of any papers. I was referring to the IWC SC’s discussion of the data that the ICR gives to them every year for their review.

        So the question is does the IWC SC believe that Japan has produced real research data. Well I guess I will let them say it in their own words.

        http://iwcoffice.org/conservation/permits.htm

        “Final Review (2007)

        An intersessional meeting to review the results from the JARPA research programme was convened in Tokyo in December 2006. The report of the JARPA Review Workshop will be published in the 2008 supplement to the journal and can be downloaded HERE (pdf 1Mb) while a copy of its conclusions can be found HERE. A short summary of the workshop is given below.

        In summary, considerable data have been collected by the JARPA programme by both lethal and non-lethal methods, but there was disagreement at the workshop regarding the analyses presented and the interpretation of some of these data. A number of recommendations for further analyses were made. Much progress has been made in addressing Antarctic minke whale abundance and trends and provided that the recommendations from the workshop are followed, the Committee may be able to agree estimates although the confidence intervals are wide and probably will preclude information on trend becoming available. For humpback whales the abundance estimates provided useful steps towards acceptable estimates of abundance.

        A considerable amount of work has been undertaken on population structure since the mid-term review held in 1997 (IWC, 1998) . It was agreed that there are at least two stocks of Antarctic minke whales present in the JARPA research area, and an area of transition in the region around 150°-165°E was suggested . The data do not support the current IWC management Areas for Antarctic minke whales. Samples from the breeding areas would greatly facilitate these analyses, and are likely to be required to resolve issues relevant to stock structure and mixing within the JARPA research area.

        The estimation of natural mortality was the main initial objective of JARPA. However, the confidence limits around the current estimate spanned such a wide range that the parameter is still effectively unknown. More precise estimates of natural mortality rates depend on the use of commercial catch-at-age data, but there are some yet unresolved problems with those data.

        The Committee welcomed the oceanographic and krill-related work undertaken since the 1997 Workshop. The Committee also agreed that considerable relevant data had been collected by the JARPA programme on matters related to body condition and feeding. However, it is clear that the nature of the analyses presented at the JARPA review meant that relatively little progress had been made in addressing the role of Antarctic minke whales in the ecosystem. However, a number of more refined analyses were presented and discussed at the Anchorage meeting.

        Levels of toxic metals and organochlorines were low compared with whales in the Northern Hemisphere.

        In conclusion, the Committee concurred with the view of the 1997 workshop that ‘The results of the JARPA programme, while not required for management under the RMP, have the potential to improve management of minke whales in the Southern Hemisphere’ in a number of ways. As has been the case in past Committee discussions on of the respective merits of lethal and non-lethal methodology, it was not possible to reach consensus amongst the participants.”

        Here let me pull some specifics out for you.

        “Much progress has been made in addressing Antarctic minke whale abundance and trends and provided that the recommendations from the workshop are followed, the Committee may be able to agree estimates although the confidence intervals are wide and probably will preclude information on trend becoming available. For humpback whales the abundance estimates provided useful steps towards acceptable estimates of abundance.”

        “The Committee welcomed the oceanographic and krill-related work undertaken since the 1997 Workshop. The Committee also agreed that considerable relevant data had been collected by the JARPA programme on matters related to body condition and feeding.”

        Sure sound like they accept some of the research data as relevant. Now I admit there are parts of the research that are questioned and some members of the SC disagree with the lethal research. But the overall statement by the SC is that there is useful data being collected.

        I can’t figure out why you cut and pasted a whale resolution not from the SC when I specifically said SC, but I guess your paymasters expect you to ignore and try and gloss over things that don’t support their views.

      • Michael Raymer

        And what does any of this have to do with the statement from the IWC:

        “FURTHER CALLS UPON the Government of Japan to suspend indefinitely the lethal aspects of JARPA II conducted within the Southern Ocean Whale Sanctuary.”

        Where is your rebuttal to this? Are you going to pull a Mick/Matt and change the subject? The IWC wants Japan to stop killing whales in the Southern Ocean Whale Sanctuary. You keep whining about the reading comprehension of others? What part of the above statement is unclear to you? How about this?:

        “CONVINCED that the aims of JARPA II do not address critically important research needs;”

        The Scientific Committee is one part of the IWC, and it reports to the whole. You seem to want to convince me that the Scientific Committee runs the IWC. It’s the other way around. But hey, let’s take a look at what YOU copied/pasted, shall we?

        “However, the confidence limits around the current estimate spanned such a wide range that the parameter is still effectively unknown.”

        “More precise estimates of natural mortality rates depend on the use of commercial catch-at-age data, but there are some yet unresolved problems with those data.”

        “‘The results of the JARPA programme, while not required for management under the RMP, have the potential to improve management of minke whales in the Southern Hemisphere’ in a number of ways. As has been the case in past Committee discussions on of the respective merits of lethal and non-lethal methodology, it was not possible to reach consensus amongst the participants.”

        Your own Scientific Committee, which you want to glue yourself too, ADMITS that it really doesn’t know what it is doing and that there is contention in its own ranks as the any effectiveness of its “research”.

        And, as you have directly admitted numerous times, the ones that want this “research” are only trying to justify the further slaughtering of whales.

        “The Japanese don’t try and hide that there main goal is to show the size and health of various whale populations to get the IWC to issue a commercial quota.”

        I made sure to paste that since you have problems remembering what you have previously said. You’re welcome.

        Anti-whaling means anti-whaling. Trying to hide behind “science” to justify your need to kill more, more, more isn’t going to work on me.

      • David

        Thanks for pulling those quotes from my post for me. The IWC says that there isn’t enough data to get good numbers yet and thus more research is needed including “catch-at-age data”. You do realize that means lethal research

        So the IWC agrees there is data but not yet enough and so Japan continues to collect more for them.

        Make points for the other side can’t look good on your performance eval. You may not get a raise this year.

      • Michael Raymer

        “The IWC says that there isn’t enough data to get good numbers yet”

        Good luck with that. How are those numbers looking this year, David?

        “You do realize that means lethal research”

        You do realize that there ain’t going to be ANY lethal research going on this year? Why? Because SSCS is issuing the whalers an ass-kicking of biblical proportions.

        And to, yet again, go back to your earlier statement: “The Japanese don’t try and hide that there main goal is to show the size and health of various whale populations to get the IWC to issue a commercial quota.”

        You do realize that no matter what happens with any “commercial quota”, the whalers are never, ever going to be able to fill one? They are going to continue getting run around the Antarctic, unable to conduct whaling operations. Hell, as we see, they are now getting run completely OUT of the Antarctic.

        Again, you guys are like Hitler in his bunker, listening to the sound of Russian artillery pounding Berlin, thinking that victory is still possible.

  • Jane

    David.i was pointing out that you perhaps did not read the organic of the treaty in question, nor did it seem that you interpreted it properly. As both an undergrad And as a grad student I have studied the unep in depth, though there is still a lot to learn. Protecting the natural resources of a planet has to be the work of every country. Japan IS breaking international law. If the un would send enforcement, Paul Watson would not need to be there. You should be thanking God that ANYONE has the passion and moral conviction to protect not only sentient species, but YOUR family from environmental exploitaton. We are still all in this together. Try and step outside your prejudices and see this thing for what it is using a more empirical standard, both in reading the intent of the law and in the science behind the notion that if we want to survive we will have to evolve ethically to take ca re of our habitat. This will be hard for you if you are paid by the iwc.

    • David

      Just what international law are the Japanese breaking? Not your interpretation of some law but an actual written law.

  • http://www.facebook.com/people/Josh-Lamb/100000872581980 Josh Lamb

    Ednakano often blames whale supporters for insulting the paid trolls of the ICR. He may not do it on ecorazzi no longer but on youtube he does.
    ednakano1 : Video response to a video of SS: Fat swindler will be arrested? in? future.

    • Mick

      @Josh Lamb

      “the paid trolls of the ICR.”

      To echo Michael Raymer: Do you have proof of this allegation? Can you PROVE that any poster on ECORAZZI is a “paid troll of the ICR”?

      • http://www.facebook.com/people/Josh-Lamb/100000872581980 Josh Lamb

        Do you have any proof of whale supporters being paid by SSCS? no? Thats why I say that. Ednakano and romika have accused us of being paid by SSCS so I can say romika and ednakano most likely david and his other accounts are paid.

      • crumpets are yummy.

        Ednakookoo and romika 3 are all over u tube.
        Naturally they get shot down in flames wherever they go.

      • Mick

        @Josh Lamb

        “Thats why I say that. Ednakano and romika have accused us of being paid by SSCS so I can say romika and ednakano most likely david and his other accounts are paid.”

        So, you have no proof of your accusation.

  • Pete

    Boy…..you people get all fired up over a fish, don’t you.

    • http://www.facebook.com/people/Josh-Lamb/100000872581980 Josh Lamb

      Whales are not fish.

  • Mick

    Michael Raymer,

    I cannot read your posts of January 11th. They are skewed on the far right of the page and are unreadable.
    I stand by my earlier comments. You can make all the pompus and self-important demands that you want. However, I and no one else for that matter are under any obligation to answer your childish demands.
    Your egostistical belief that you are so important that everyone in the world has to answer to you, is ludicrous and delusional.

    I say again, There would also be far less reason for him to worry if Animal Planet and Discovery Channel executives were not goading SS into committing increasingly dangerous stunts in order to boost ratings for a TV show.

    • http://www.facebook.com/people/Josh-Lamb/100000872581980 Josh Lamb

      Stunts? have they not done these tactics before? yes they have. They have rammed illgal pirate vessels, they have boarded ships, they have thrown stuff at ships and they have rammed japanese whaling vessels before the show was ever an idea. Captain Watson has been beaten up, dropped into antartic ice several times, kicked till his face was pure blood, and risked his life for animals that dont have a voice. These “Stunts” have been around since the creation of SS. As well as animal planet does not pay SS for taping they pay a small fee for food, and space taken by the film crew and thats all.

    • Michael Raymer

      And again, I say that you are knowingly making a false accusation with absolutely no proof whatsoever. Therefore, your allegations are as pathetic as your attempt to sway the debate in an irrelevant direction. You are a coward for posting in this manner. You have no credibility at all. You should give Glenn Inwood your last paycheck back because you have done nothing to earn it.

      BTW, for anyone keeping score at home:

      http://www.seashepherd.org/news-and-media/news-110112-1.html

      “The mysterious and elusive supply ship for the Japanese whaling fleet has been located. At 1420 hours on January 12 AEST, Sea Shepherd Conservation Society’s scout and interceptor vessel the Gojira found the Japanese refueling and supply ship. It is identified as the Panamanian registered Sun Laurel (IMO# 9405631), and it was found at 62 degrees 43 minutes south and 178 degrees 33 minutes west.”

      “So if we can’t go to the Nisshin Maru, the Nisshin Maru will have to come to us,” said Admiral(corrected) Watson. “They need to refuel soon, and we will be here with the Sun Laurel waiting for them to arrive. Refueling south of 60 degrees is illegal and we intend to enforce the Antarctic Treaty if they attempt to violate it.”

      Guess what Mick? It’s over and you lose. The whalers are getting the ass-kicking of biblical proportions that I have predicted all along. This season will be a travesty of lost money for the ICR. The whalers will be sent home with their tail between their legs and their holds empty. The public will, of course, be made well aware of their abject humiliation. SSCS contributions will skyrocket even more than they have to date. If the whalers actually try this again next year, they will get another ass-kicking. Hell, I won’t be surprised if SSCS gets that 4th ship that GreenPeace isn’t helping out with.

      Now, lets talk about the “common frontline whaling retard” (to paraphrase romika). If there is an attempt to conduct whaling next year, who are they going to get to crew the whaling vessels? I can tell you that right now, the poor saps working on these vessels are wondering what the hell they’re doing there. The thought is sinking in that they just sailed thousands of miles to get chased around the Antarctic by a bunch of vegans (hmmm…there’s a song in there, somewhere). The thought is sinking in that they could have stayed home and filed for unemployment, and made as much if not more money. I predict (an in case you haven’t noticed, I’m a pretty good predictor) that the whaling fleet is going to have some significant problems staffing their ships next year. Would you work for them, knowing that you are, at best, going to make a fry-cooks wages?

      It’s all over except for the crying, Mick. Your side lost. To quote Cardinal Richelieu, “And if in the end you should lose, try to do so with a becoming grace.”

  • Mick

    @Michael Raymer

    “I say that you are knowingly making a false accusation with absolutely no proof whatsoever.”

    Good for you. Your welcome to your opinions.

    “You should give Glenn Inwood your last paycheck back because you have done nothing to earn it.”

    It’s quite telling that you accuse someone else of making a “false accusation with absolutely no proof whatsoever” and in the same paragraph you go on to make a false accusation with absolutely no proof whatsoever.
    Yet you say that I have no credibility??? How childish. I would suggest that you grow up and gain some experience in the real world before lecturing others.

    • Michael Raymer

      Well, you see Mick, those of us who come here in defense of the whales do so because we wish to preserve intelligent life and end their suffering. You come here because you wish to destroy it. I simply have a hard time imagining that you would do so for free. I mean, seriously, what is it about a dead whale that turns you on so much (hmmm…cetacean necrophilia. Yuck!)? Why is it so important to you that any animal that isn’t endangered, gets killed? I find this disturbing and, in all my time here, it has never been explained to me. I also find it disturbing that, if you’re not getting paid, you choose to spend your free time like this. In other words, I would probably give you minute, trace amounts of respect if you admitted you are getting paid. Since you don’t admit to this, I must conclude that you are just a very strange person.

  • Mick

    @Michael Raymer

    “I find this disturbing”

    Well then, that just makes you a ‘disturbed’ person, Michael. You should seek professional help.

    “in all my time here, it has never been explained to me.”

    Well Michael, the reason no one has “explained” it to you is because no one owes you an explanation.

    Like most people, I have a multitude of reasons to oppose SS’s actions. I will explain those reasons if and/or when it suits me to do so.

    • Michael Raymer

      No Mick, you’re not going to explain anything. You are going to do your usual tapdance, your usual schtick. But I am confident that nothing you say will explain anything. You’ve had this entire thread to explain and you haven’t done anything but waste time. Hey, if you were wasting fuel too, we could call you a whaler!

  • Mick

    @Michael Raymer

    “you’re not going to explain anything.”

    It seems your catching on. That’s right, i’m not going to explain anything to you or anyone else, for that matter.

    • Michael Raymer

      “I will explain those reasons if and/or when it suits me to do so.”

      ” That’s right, i’m not going to explain anything to you or anyone else, for that matter.”

      It seems we have gone from whaling to Multiple Personality Disorder. One has to wonder which version of Mick is going to show up today.

      Mick, if you have no intention of explaining, “anything to you or anyone else, for that matter”, what exactly are you doing on a public discussion board? I think we all know the answer. It’s a one word answer that begins with “T”.

      • Mick

        @Michael Raymer

        “Mick, if you have no intention of explaining () what exactly are you doing on a public discussion board?”

        So, according to you, anyone who posts a comment on a “public discussion board” has to explain their reasons for doing so, to you?

      • Michael Raymer

        I’ll ask you the same question I asked David: Are you here to debate whaling? Or are you here just to take pot-shots at other people? At least with David, we sometimes have a debate between the insults.

        You just made the above post, and I fail to see what is has to do with the discussion at hand.

        “So, according to you, anyone who posts a comment on a “public discussion board” has to explain their reasons for doing so, to you?”

        Not to me. To everyone. Why else would you be on that particular forum?

        Can we please get back to whaling now?

      • Mick

        @Michael Raymer

        “Not to me. To everyone.”

        Why is that? Why do you think that a person has to explain their reasons for posting comments on a public website to “everyone”?

        “Can we please get back to whaling now?”

        Sure.

      • Michael Raymer

        You still haven’t answered the question: Are you here to debate whaling or not. Because you still haven’t.

        David and I are shooting IWC pages at each other. Romika is trying to start a fire with SSCS financials. Pete thinks whales are fish. Some guy named Mike is trying to convince us that whales reproduce like rabbits.

        And then there’s Mick.

        The only thing you have done on this thread is make one bogus accusation and a dozen or more posts not backing it up. You are not here for me any more than I am here for you. We will never change each others minds. We are here for the person(s) who happened to click on this site, then happened to read through the commentary. What have you done on this thread to convice anyone that whaling is good and SSCS is bad? Nothing that I can see. What research (oooh, there’s that word again) do you have to show the casual onlooker? What insights do you have to share? I don’t care if you call me names. I don’t care if you try to refute the clear evidence that I show, supporting my position. But, will you please for the love of God say something, anything that has to do with the subject at hand?

      • Mick

        @Michael Raymer

        “You still haven’t answered the question: Are you here to debate whaling or not.”

        You still haven’t answered my question either:
        Why do you think a person has to explain their reasons for posting comments on a public website?

      • Michael Raymer

        Mick, I gave as direct an answer as is humanly possible in my last post! I answered your question! How are you not seeing it?

        To the casual onlooker reading this thread: It is obvious that Mick is a tool and a troll who is more interested in a game of internet tag than any form of constructive debate (with or without temper). While I admit my own complicity in this game of back and forth, anyone can see that it is of Micks doing, not mine. I am sorry you have had to read through this crap just to be able to see the actual conversation being attempted by others. To explain my own involvement in this unfortunate affair, I can only say that Mick was not always this pathetic. I distinctly remember Mick being one of the first people I “battled” when I originally found this site. At the time, well….he was still a tool. But, he was a tool with something to say. How he devolved into the quivering mass of nothing-to-say that you see here is beyond me. And that’s his problem.

        Mick, when you have something to say about the discussion at hand, I will have a response. Until then, you can piss into the wind by yourself.

      • Mick

        @Michael Raymer

        “Mick, I gave as direct an answer as is humanly possible in my last post! I answered your question!”

        What, pray tell, in your post do you consider to be a ‘direct answer’ to the question: “Why do you think a person has to explain their reasons for posting comments on a public website?”

        If you do not want to answer the question; just say so.

  • romika3

    Folks, Just catching up on all the posts. The issue here is that we have an individual who previously worked with the Fox Network. The network, from what I have learned is noted for its approach to issues. This individual is now promoting a series that validates the use of violence and terror as a tool to bring about change. Youth and in individuals who may be on the “edge” might see this series as a validation of their thinking and we all know where that can lead. Bottomline, the SSCS is an eco-terrorist organization that uses terror and terrorist tactics to achieve their goals, selects issues based on the money making and media potential and who’s leader instructs the members to lie and distort the truth. This has nothing to do with whales. Perhaps those of you who are working for the SSCS can post data in membership demographics and profile.

  • romika3

    “common frontline whaling retard”, Micheal, you have just exposed your true colours. I say no more.

    • Michael Raymer

      If only that were true.

  • romika3

    “those of us who come here in defense of the whales do so because we wish to preserve intelligent life and end their suffering” incorrect, it has come to my attention that some of these individuals are SSCS staff working out of their office. I yet to get offical confirmation but I have somebody working on it for me.

    • Michael Raymer

      Ah yes, I’ve been waiting to hear more from romikas “contacts” on his Super-Sleuth Spy Network. Sleeper agents with tiny microphones, and report back to HQ. Silenced pistols and cyanide capsules. Got it.

      Man, you guys are getting desperate…..and amusing. Please post more. And keep us up to date on your deep-cover operative. Tell me, does he have a tiny camera?

      • romika3

        Will post when I receive the material.

      • crumpets are yummy.

        still waiting romika3…tick tick tick tick tick

  • romika3

    “The whalers are getting the ass-kicking of biblical proportions that I have predicted all along.” There is no evidence that this is happening, only a picture of a “Bat Boat” next to an iceberg and some video that perhaps might be last years video. As far as we know Watson might sitting in a bar eating hambergers and drinking beer while he totaling up the checks that role in!!!!!!

    • Michael Raymer

      http://www.seashepherd.org/news-and-media/news-110112-2.html

      “The Sea Shepherd ships have been chasing the Nisshin Maru factory ship for two weeks. Two of the three illegal harpoon vessels have been tailing the Sea Shepherd ships for two weeks and have not killed any whales. There is reason to believe that the third harpoon vessel has not taken any whales because it appears to be traveling with the Nisshin Maru to avoid being tracked down by Sea Shepherd.

      The Steve Irwin and the Bob Barker will escort the Sun Laurel supply vessel to prevent refueling, and the Gojira will break off within a few hours to resume the hunt for the Nisshin Maru.

      Sea Shepherd has shut down all whaling operations for two weeks as of today.”

      http://www.icrwhale.org/pdf/110109ReleaseENG.pdf

      “9 January 2011
      Bob Barker activists attack Japanese research vessel Yushin Maru No. 2
      The Yushin Maru No. 2 (YS2), a Japanese Antarctic whale research vessel was subjected to
      attack today by the Netherlands-registered vessel Bob Barker (BB). The attack started at
      about 1800JST and lasted until about 1840JST”

      “There is no evidence that this is happening”

      The ICR itself has provided evidence that this is happening. But, that’s not good enough for romika the Super-Sleuth.

  • romika3

    Michael Raymer, January 12, 2011 at 8:57 pm
    “And there are hundreds of peer reviewed papers that have been produced.”

    “No there aren’t.” yes there are and the majority are on the minke whale!!! Check the list on the ICR site. They do good science.

    • http://www.facebook.com/people/Josh-Lamb/100000872581980 Josh Lamb

      Did you look at the video, with actual scientists? There are as they descirbe “4 somewhat relevent reaserch papers”

      • David

        Did you watch the video?

        2 avowed anti-whaling scientist and 1 unknown status scientist being paid by an anti-whaling biased TV show review all the papers in one day and some of the papers are in disciplines that none of them have.

        And they complain about the Japanese science?

      • Michael Raymer

        We don’t complain about Japanese (whaling) science. There is no Japanese whaling science. It’s all a sham.

      • romika3

        Folks, what is see here http://www.icrwhale.org/JARPA91paper.htm
        is a list of peer reviewed papers published in a varity of scientific journals.

      • Michael Raymer

        Let’s have a look at these “peer reviewed” studies from the link that romika provided:

        Interannual changes in body fat condition index of minke whales in the Antarctic.

        Factors affecting in vitro maturation of minke whale (Balaenoptera acutorostrata) follicular oocytes.

        Endocrinological observations of female minke whales (Balaenoptera acutorostrata).

        Lack of population subdivision among the minke whales

        Development and Physiological Degradation of Tooth Buds and Development of Rudiment of Baleen Plate in Southern Minke Whale, Balaenoptera acutorostrata.

        First record of movement of a southern right whale (Eubalaena australis) between warm water breeding grounds and the Antarctic ocean, South of 60°S. (Apparently, they had to kill whales to write this paper)

        Validation of the Sperm Quality Analyzer and the Hypo-osmotic Swelling Test for Frozen-thawed Ram and Minke Whale (Balaenoptera bonarensis) Spermatozoa. (I’d say that the sperm quality was pretty poor since the whale that was carrying it was DEAD!

        Relationship between the appearance of preantral follicles in the fetal ovary of Antarctic minke whales (Balaenoptera bonaerensis) and hormone concentrations in the fetal heart, umbilical cord and maternal blood.

        That last one is my favorite.

        Folks, look at the link that romika provided. For one thing, who are these “peers” that reviewed this tripe? Secondly, where does this “research” play out? What does “hormone concentrations in the fetal heart, umbilical cord and maternal blood” have to do with anything at all? Isn’t this the whales business and not ours? And what do the Japanese think they are going to do with the findings of this “research”. Are they going to eventually benefit the whale populations of the world by offering caesarian sections?

        Like my friends and I have been saying this whole time, ICR “whale research” is a sham that they hide behind so they can kill whales and sell the meat.

        P.S. Mick and Matt, if you’re out there (which you probably aren’t), THIS IS HOW YOU ANSWER A QUESTION. THIS IS HOW YOU RESPOND IN A DEBATE.

      • David

        Well Michael continues to show he doesn’t understand science and he doesn’t know (or intentionally ‘forgets’) anything about the Japanese research.

        Japan has the world’s largest non-lethal whale research program, so implying that the ‘had to kill whales’ for the paper on southern right whales isn’t THE WAY TO RESPOND IN A DEBATE.

        And he asks who these peers are. Well he obviously looked at the list (then cherry picked some papers to try and ridicule) so he saw where they were published. Well that is where he needs to look for who the reviewers where.

        Then because he doesn’t understand the big words in the title of a paper he implies it must not be real science.

        And then we get this statement; “Are they going to eventually benefit the whale populations of the world by offering caesarian sections?”. I am not even sure what to call this, a strawman maybe? Whatever it is, it is a silly attempt at an argument. The Japanese don’t try and hide that there main goal is to show the size and health of various whale populations to get the IWC to issue a commercial quota.

      • crumpets are yummy.

        Come on Romika3, how can you post that rubbish with a straight face?

        Japanese research whaling is for fools.

      • Michael Raymer

        “Japan has the world’s largest non-lethal whale research program,”

        So the whalers aren’t killing whales in the Southern Ocean Whale Sanctuary? Is that what David is saying? Are these harpoons that the whalers use tranquilizer harpoons? Those aren’t dead whales that they load on the Nisshin Maru? They are merely “asleep” and will be returned to the wild once they wake up?

        “And he asks who these peers are.”

        Yes I do. Would you care to stop your puerile ranting long enough to answer?

        “Well he obviously looked at the list (then cherry picked some papers to try and ridicule)”

        Nope, I could have gone on and on and on. I limited the number of bogus articles to keep the size of the post a reasonable size. And in case you didn’t notice, (and obviously, in your zeal to respond to me instead of the issue, you didn’t) I encourage EVERYONE to check out the link that romika provided, and make up their own mind.

        “Then because he doesn’t understand the big words in the title of a paper he implies it must not be real science.”

        The difference between you and me, David, is I do understand the big words. It’s bogus science hiding behind those big words. Again, the people don’t need you or me to tell them that. They just have to look for themselves.

        “The Japanese don’t try and hide that there main goal is to show the size and health of various whale populations to get the IWC to issue a commercial quota.”

        On that, we agree. And it ain’t going to happen. The whalers days are numbered.

        David, for christsakes, take a vacation and come back fresh. You’re not even making me work at this anymore.

  • romika3

    “The Steve Irwin and the Bob Barker will escort the Sun Laurel supply vessel to prevent refueling,” the SSCS is now attacking oil tankers, what is next for this eco-terrorist organization. Are there not oil tankers being attacked off of Africa, does the SSCS fall under the same catigory as these groups? You answer the question, its time the SSCS has it’s chartiable status revoked.

    • Michael Raymer

      Please explain how you link “escort” to “attack”. And if they were “attacked”, why hasn’t the ICR put it up on their news page? As of this post, there is nothing posted after January 9th. Apparently not even the ICR considers this an attack.

      • crumpets are yummy.

        I haven’t seen any attacks Romika3, please provide evidence, fact is the refueling ship was heading below 60 degrees, and as we all know, it is illegal to refuel below 60 degrees.

    • http://www.facebook.com/people/Josh-Lamb/100000872581980 Josh Lamb

      Dont be mad they found your lifeline hahaha

  • romika3

    Not much SSCS foolishness on YouTube lately, it looks like the terrorism flag is working!

    • http://www.facebook.com/people/Josh-Lamb/100000872581980 Josh Lamb

      The terrorism report is for videos supporting terrorism, IE. Jihad recruit videos, support of 9/11 videos, support of killing troops in the middle east etc.

      • crumpets are yummy.

        Well I suppose Romika couldn’t help but press a terrorism flag…he has been waving it for long enough. Press that flag romika3.I’m sure it gives you great pleasure.

        Fact is SSCS are doing a great job in the Southern Ocean.

        They have the whalers on the ropes down there, not much action for the moment but thats fine, as long as the Japanese are not whaling then everything is just fine and dandy an as it should be.

        Japan just has to suck on it.

        It is clear that SSCS are the most effective marine conservation society in the world.

  • romika3

    Can somebodd fill me in on this? Is Watson salting money away for his retirement?

    - IRS documents also show that the non-profit, donation run, Sea Shepherd society made a series of loans to its wholly-owned affiliate, the for-profit “Northern Development Associates”, between 1998 and 2003.

    - Tax returns for “Northern Development Associates” show losses of $222,611 in 2000, $201,180 in 2001 and $127,633 in 2002. All the while, “Northern Development Associates” was receiving loans from the tax exempt Sea Shepherd Society to the tune of nearly $900,000.

    - In 2002, for the first time in history, Sea Shepherd’s tax return showed the Society had incorporated the losses of “Northern Developments Associates” into its own bottom line even though it was gifted to the Society years before.

    • Michael Raymer

      romika, you need to post the link(s) to posts like this. I’m not coming after you on this, I am requesting the link (just like I asked crumpets for a link about a week ago) because without it, no one can verify the veracity of the statements.

      Either way, it’s the whales I’m concerned about.

      • crumpets are yummy.

        Yes, evidence please, Romika3.

      • romika3

        Folks, came across this by accident and upon further diging I have come up with more. Another eye opener to say the least.

        http://www.canadafreepress.com/2005/higgins100705.htm

      • Michael Raymer

        Fom the linked article:

        “In his comments Mr. Watson took it upon himself to question my research and belittle both my intelligence and character.”

        Anyone who comes here should recognize a game of tag-you’re-it when they see it. The author gets bent out of shape at Watson and just has to come back at him.

        The article is a hodgepodge of circumstancial evidence revolving around a non-profit organization making a loan to a for-profit organization. This happens all the time, everywhere and there is nothing illegal or even wrong about about it. There’s also some tripe in there where the author tries to play the guilt-by-association card. BORING!

        Typical pissing contest. But, as always, I encourage the reader to click on the link and make up your own mind.

    • http://www.facebook.com/people/Josh-Lamb/100000872581980 Josh Lamb

      What is this? The ICR illegaly gifting whale meat to there employees? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MhlOxfAljAo As well as the head of the ICR admitting this was illegal and tarnishes there image? http://en.mercopress.com/2010/12/24/japanese-fishing-agency-officials-admit-taking-gifts-of-whale-meat

  • romika3

    The Public Record:

    1 – In 2000 Sea Shepherd reported income of $129,749 from consulting fees however there was no indication what sort of consulting this was, or for whom it was performed. Coincidentally, in the tax year immediately following, Paul Watson, who has long prided himself in not taking any salary from the society, began doing just that.

    2 – In 2002 the Sea Shepherd Society passed out $35,000 in grants. Despite IRS requirements to do so, the Society did not divulge the recipients of those grants.

    3 – In 2003 Sea Shepherd made a grant of $8,000 to OrcaForce International, a group supposedly started by Watson’s ex-wife. Even though the Sea Shepherd Society’s tax return shows this $8,000 amount as a contribution, at the time, the OrcaForce address was listed on the society’s web site as a Sea Shepherd International address.

    Over the years several instances have been identified where assets have been moved between Sea Shepherd and OrcaForce and although OrcaForce appears to have a Canadian address, investigation did not uncover any registration or structural information on this group in either the U.S. or Canada.

    4 – The liabilities of the Sea Shepherd Society jumped from $2,122, which was about normal for this group, to $222,889 in 1999. Most of this amount was related to a Mortgage at Washington Federal Savings and Loan however as far as could be determined, no details of what this loan is related to is available.

    5 — Although the Sea Shepherd Society does not have a large number of donors those who contribute do so in a very big way and many of these gifts are one time donations. This would appear to be a little out of the ordinary for an organization of this type since most non-profits rely on large numbers of smaller gifts to operate.

    Often, rather than hard cash, gifts to Sea Shepherd take the form of stock in major corporations. Contributions to the society have been made in everything from Harley Davidson stock ($122,000 from guitarist Mike Galesi) to Exxon-Mobile stock valued at nearly 100,000 gifted by a Ms. Whilhelmina Angel of Florida.

    The donation of Exxon-Mobile stock may have been purely legitimate, however it appears to be an odd gift for Mr. Watson to accept when one considers his comments at a speaking engagement just last month.

    “I won’t give one penny for Katrina relief. Ill give for the animals but not for relief efforts until the oil companies pony up millions for the destruction caused by global warming.”

    Although many of the Society’s contributors are from the U.S, there have been some Canadian donors as well, including one whom made her donation by way of Wappel Law in Toronto. This law firm works with non-profit organizations and boasts Tom Wappel the Liberal Party member for Scarborough Southwest, who recently voted in Parliament on a bill related to non-profit organizations, as a Senior Partner.

    6 — The following is a rather lengthy and complex set of cir****tances. Most of the items listed below might not appear interesting on their own, however when viewed together they are rather disconcerting.

    - One of Sea Shepherd’s biggest financial supporters is Ms. Ann Johnston, wife of Florida land developer Mr. Pritam Singh (not his original name). Mr. Singh, (original name Paul LaBombard) was banned from banking for life in 1995 and ordered to pay $1.2 million dollars by federal bank regulators for his financing activities on a Key West business. According to the Key News Journal, Singh has also been investigated by the FBI for his questionable business practices and a Key West attorney has filed a lawsuit against him, alleging almost 20 years of criminal activity — including racketeering and fraud.

    - Both Singh and his wife are very closely connected with both the Sea Shepherd Society and the Watson family.

    - The relationship between Johnston, Singh and Watson goes back a number of years. In September of 2003 Ms. Johnston’s signature appears, along with Watson’s and his wife’s, on a loan for property listed at the same address in Washington State as the Society’s headquarters. A Deed of Trust was filed in September of that year stating that a property in “Friday Harbor” Washington was used to secure this loan valued at about $221,000.

    According to a recent St. John’s Telegram article, the same day this transaction took place, in fact just 5 hours afterward, Ms. Johnston gave a 66% interest in the land to the Watson’s for $10 dollars. This gift was not to the Society itself, but rather to the Watson’s directly. Also at that time, Johnston granted the Watsons another option on property. The Watson’s secured additional mortgages of $50,000 and $30,000 on April 15, 2004. Within two months all debts were paid off in full.

    IRS returns for the Society in that year reported that Sea Shepherd had sold a property listed as “Friday Harbor land and buildings” for $165,938, reporting a loss on the transaction of $184,862. Is this the same property that was used just a couple of months before to secure a $221,000 loan?

    Although a search of San Juan County records did not reveal the “Friday Harbor” transaction having taken place, they do show a flurry of transactions involving both Paul Watson and Ann Johnston.

    - In addition to her involvement in a property loan, Ms. Johnston cemented herself as a premier contributor by making a donation to the Society claimed to have been valued at nearly 2.7 million dollars. This gift consisted of a company called “Northern Development Associates”, a for-profit business with holdings in Alaska.

    - Both Johnston and her husband Singh have not only shown great financial generosity to the Sea Shepherd Society, Mr. Singh has also been listed as a member of the financial and management advisory board for the Society, despite his less than spotless financial history.

    - When Paul Watson was elected as director of the Sierra club in 2003 he listed his home as “Misty Fjords Lodge”, even though he has admitted that he never actually lived there. This lodge, which was a part of the 2.7 million dollar “Northern Development Associates” gift, has been identified by Watson as a research facility however the lodge is registered with the US forestry service as having a permit as a fishing lodge. It appears to qualify as the only licensed fishing lodge inside Misty Fjords National Monument in Alaska.

    - A corporate search shows two relevant entities named “Northern Development Associates”. One of these is in Alaska (where the lodge is located), the other is in Florida (where Ann Johnston and her husband, developer Pritam Singh, live). Records show major overlap between both the names and addresses of many board members of the Sea Shepherd society, “Northern Development Associates” and various companies owned by Singh / Johnston.

    For example, records show that in 1999 Watson’s ex-wife Lisa Distefano, who has been connected with the mysterious OrcaForce organization, was a board member of “Northern Development Associates”. At the time her address of record was listed as that of Mr. Singh’s golf course development in Key West. In addition to Ms. Distefano, several other members of the Sea Shepherd Society board have shown multiple addresses and many of these can be traced directly back to Singh properties.

    - IRS documents also show that the non-profit, donation run, Sea Shepherd society made a series of loans to its wholly-owned affiliate, the for-profit “Northern Development Associates”, between 1998 and 2003.

    - Tax returns for “Northern Development Associates” show losses of $222,611 in 2000, $201,180 in 2001 and $127,633 in 2002. All the while, “Northern Development Associates” was receiving loans from the tax exempt Sea Shepherd Society to the tune of nearly $900,000.

    - In 2002, for the first time in history, Sea Shepherd’s tax return showed the Society had incorporated the losses of “Northern Developments Associates” into its own bottom line even though it was gifted to the Society years before.

    - On November 8, 2004, the Misty Fjords Lodge (the primary asset of “Northern Development Associates”), was sold to a newly-formed company, Misty Fjords, LLC, located at 6805 Overseas Highway, Marathon, Florida. Online records at the Florida Department of State’s Corporations Division name the President/Director of Misty Fjords, LLC as none other than Pritam Singh, the husband of the original donor Ms. Johnston.

    At the time of sale the property was identified by the realtor as being listed for $1 million dollars under the appraised value.

    - In April of 1999 the Sea Shepherd Society received a donation of a “Key West Home and Land” in Florida which the Society claimed was valued at $329,500. They re-sold this property less than 2 months later for $850,000 yet claimed an overall loss on the transaction of more than $265,000 due to related costs.

    According to sources, a search of Monroe County, Florida (Marathon, Key West) records show that Sea Shepherd sold a “Single Family Home” at 5 Crane Blvd., Sugarloaf Key, FL for $850,000 on June 2, 1999. A mapquest and 1999 satellite photo search find no structures at this location.

    Sea Shepherd reported $64,070 in expenses for maintenance at the Key West property as “Program Service Expenses,” indicating the money was spent to further the organization’s tax-exempt purpose.

    It is not known if Singh or Johnston were involved in this transaction since the name of the donor was not found in available documents however this information may be contained in Statement 1 of Sea Shepherd’s Form 990 tax return for fiscal 1998 submitted to the IRS.

    What does it all mean?

    Consider that this organization enjoys tax exempt status but appears to be involved very closely with questionable business interests. The Society and its leader have been involved in everything from intentionally sinking ships to booby trapping trees which loggers must try to harvest (the practice of which is suspected of seriously injuring at least one mill worker) and they’ve been involved in generally disrupting legal business enterprises.

  • crumpets are yummy.

    the point is???

    • romika3

      “I encourage the reader to make up their own mind.”

  • crumpets are yummy.

    5 — Although the Sea Shepherd Society does not have a large number of donors those who contribute do so in a very big way and many of these gifts are one time donations. This would appear to be a little out of the ordinary for an organization of this type since most non-profits rely on large numbers of smaller gifts to operate.

    ooooo weally womika3? Wealy and twuly?

    Look, i have to say, this stuff has been written by just another disgruntled ex sealer with an ax to grind and trying to make yet anther case against sea Shepherd. I actually started to *yawn* once i got to this point and didn’t bother going any further, its short on substance and big on inuendo. With this kind of stuff, unless you have the books open in front of you , its just a waste of time.

    Investigation revealed no working link romoka3…where is it?

  • crumpets are yummy.

    Womika, wasn’t this stuff written in yet another Canadian newspaper? As we all know Canadian newspapers are about as reliable as my constipated dog.

    • crumpets are yummy.

      Myles Higgins..I was right, another guy with an ax to grind about the Canadian seal hunt protesters.

      http://www.maninnature.com/MMammals/Seals/Seals1h.html

      • Michael Raymer

        Wow! Double wow! This guy is good. Now I see where David and Mick get it from. This Myles guy must run a school for this. The Myles Higgins Academy of Spin, Distortion and Making Shit Up. No shortage of dubious “facts” and editorialising here. “Let us club baby seals and everything will be fine.” I’m glad we cleared that up.

        What is it with you people that you just need to kill babies? Baby whales, baby seals. Any other infants out there that you would like to slaughter?

    • romika3

      “As we all know Canadian newspapers are about as reliable as my constipated dog.” You shouldn’t be feeding your dog American Newspapers!

  • boo radley

    One matter that was raised between officials from the two countries was whether the U.S. government could revoke Sea Shepherd’s tax-emempt status, leading senior U.S. negotiator Monica Medina to conclude that the administration “can demonstrate the group does not deserve tax exempt status based on their aggressive and harmful actions.”

    Sea Shepherd’s Paul Watson responded to the release of the cables by arguing that “Sea Shepherd has not violated a single American law, and therefore the U.S. government has no cause to act against a U.S. organization and its U.S. citizens merely at the pleasure of Japan to request that it does so,” and pointing out that if the U.S. government did look into his organization’s activities, “then they obviously did not find any irregularities or unlawful activities because Sea Shepherd was never contacted by any U.S. government official in connection with this matter.”