pete-ady
by Michael dEstries
Categories: Animals, Causes
Tags: , .

Pete Bethune has had a very busy past 12 months.

It was only a little over a year ago, on January 7th, 2010, that the former Sea Shepherd lost his prized trimaran “Ady Gil” after a collision with a Japanese whaling vessel. Then came the bold move to board a whaling ship under the cover of darkness, followed by jail time in Japan, subsequent release, and a very public falling-out with Sea Shepherd in October. He later released a memoir about his adventures and announced plans to form his own ocean conservation group called “ECO” or “Earthrace Conservation Organization”.

Along the way, the man that allowed the SS to add Bethune’s boat to their fleet, Ady Gil, has gone from Hollywood TV businessman and benefactor to ocean conservationist. He’s currently in Taiji working to build local support against the much-publicized dolphin hunts there — and has backed Bethune 100% since he left Sea Shepherd.

In light of a reported lawsuit from Ady Gil that Paul Watson revealed on his Facebook page recently, I contacted both men to get their side of the story; as well as shed light on a few questions that have been swirling in online forums — most notably the always informative Planet Ocean Alliance boards.

Ecorazzi: Regarding the recent lawsuit drama: In a letter posted by Watson, your attorney stated: “If we do not have your agreement to do so by 5:00 p.m. on November 15, 2010 we will proceed with filing an action against Sea Shepherd and Mr. Watson to recover $1,000.000 plus interest, as well as punitive damages.” What made you decide not to file — and why do believe Watson chose to say that you did and only recently?

Ady Gil: I have been in communication with Sea Shepherd about it since January of 2010. I had a face to face meeting with Paul few months before the last campaign, and wanted to resolve the two issues: naming rights and $500K, which remains outstanding. He claimed that he needed money for the next campaign and wanted to see if I was sympathetic to the delaying of the naming of a replacement vessel to “Ady Gil II”. I agreed to give Sea Shepherd a reasonable amount of time to find a replacement boat. We shook hands and called for a new beginning. On October 26, 2010, I was badly insulted by a Sea Shepherd board member while trying to resolve this issue. At that point I decided that the only way to resolve it would be through my lawyers. My lawyers sent them a letter stating my intent, which has partially now been made public information by Paul Watson via Facebook. An unsatisfactory and unprofessional action. This letter of intent to sue was acknowledged by Sea Shepherd’s lawyers. I continue to reserve the right to sue them, but actually would like to see if they will to resolve it without the need of the court system.

I have no idea why Paul Watson chose now to disclose the intention to sue and why it was made so public.

Ecorazzi: Can you tell us a bit more about what you’re doing in Taiji? The reports I’ve read is that your intent on “building bridges”. Many have asked how that might be different as opposed to what SS has done there over the last several months.

Ady Gil: The only way to make a change in Japan is to have the Japanese people want a change. We can not come here to their country and TELL them what to do. As horrible as the dolphin hunt is, and I have seen it with my own eyes, it is what they do. No different than factory farming in the US. If there was a culture of “Cow Loving”, if we thought that cows are “cute”, if cows played with balls and hoops, we would feel the same about cow slaughter.

The fact is that the majority of the people in Japan love dolphins. Tangalooma in Australia offers its guests a better way to interact with dolphins, other people only get to see them in aquariums. Japan has 100 of the 500 aquariums world wide, (data that I got from an official person in Japan).

We have posted statistics about Taiji. Fisheries are a declining business here. It just went down from about 12% to about 8%, in 5 short years, of total business revenue in the city. Building the bridges will possibly open their eyes to use the treasure that they have, hundreds of dolphins in the oceans, to bring people here, to watch and swim with dolphins, and revive the economy in Taiji.

Ecorazzi: In a recent interview, you mentioned that you like to salvage the Ady Gil. Is this something you would literally like to do? Have you (or Pete) had any reports that the Gil might still be floating around out there?

Pete Bethune: The designers are adamant the boat is still afloat. Ady Gil only weighed about 18 ton, but the foam core she is made of will support 24 ton. She was such a light boat, and in all probability she will still be floating in the southern ocean still.

Ady Gil: There is a chance that the boat is still there. It is a very light construction, so even full of water it is probably still there. Despite what Sea Shepherd is saying, that I was the “Owner” of the boat, the entire deal was a mechanism for them to obtain it and keep it. People think that I wanted to own “Earthrace” later to be named “Ady Gil”. The fact is that Sea Shepherd was not sure if New Zealand will let them keep the flag on the boat, and whether or not they would have to pay 15% sales tax if they bought it. They had my $1,000,000 for about 5 weeks. To facilitate the deal I came up with what now appears to be a really stupid idea for me. I will buy Earthrace Limited NZ, then charter the boat to Sea Shepherd for $1. I did not ask them for insurance and had no right to name the crew. $1 for a $1.5 Million is a gift.

Now all of a sudden it is my boat. So, yes, technically it is, and if I find it I can probably retain it. But the fact is, that if I do, you will see how Sea Shepherd will claim that it is their boat. We really need to be honorable in life. The basic deal was: “Put my name on the boat and I will give you $1,000,000” As we all say, “No good deed goes unpunished” I have done so many good deeds, and never had that kind of a punishment as I got from Sea Shepherd.

Ecorazzi: How are plans for your next boat coming along? What are the next steps?

Pete Bethune: Concept designs nearly completed. We will start fundraising later this year. Realistically it will be 3 years before she is in the water.

Ecorazzi: You’ve received a lot of wonderful feedback on your new Earthrace Conservation Org — are you encouraged by the support? Can you reveal anymore about the Faroe Islands campaign later this year?

Pete Bethune: Yeah, it has been very heartening. We’ve got chapters in four countries all starting in next few weeks, and we’ll roll out to others later in the year. I was worried that people would not want to support a new organisation, but it seems many are willing to get involved. I am very keen to have an organisation that empowers people to take ownership of marine conservation in their area. I don’t want them just fundraising for one campaign that happens on the other side of the world. I want them actively working in their area. All countries pretty much have marine conservation issues to be worked on. Faroes campaign will be Jun 15 – Sep 15. Still working out the details. It will be one of 6 large campaigns this year, plus the many smaller ones happening locally.

Ecorazzi: How has the new book, “Whale Warrior“, been selling?

Pete Bethune: The new book is selling well. The feedback is really good from people who have read it. When in prison, I really put my soul into writing it. I’ve never written such personal stuff before. The third section especially which covers my time incarcerated. But I hesitated for a few days to hand the manuscript over to the publishers. I was worried my soul would end up in a bargain bin selling for $5. Or people would laugh at my thoughts. I considered that maybe I should take some stuff out. In the end I said ‘bugger it’ — and I handed it over. I’m glad I did. Looking at it now, it is the section I am proudest of. If you read the book I reckon you really get to know me.

About Michael dEstries

Michael has been blogging since 2005 on issues such as sustainability, renewable energy, philanthropy, and healthy living. He regularly contributes to a slew of publications, as well as consulting with companies looking to make an impact using the web and social media. He lives in Ithaca, NY with his family on an apple farm.

View all posts by Michael dEstries →
  • Michael Raymer

    The “salvage” thing cracks me up. The only thing they are going to save(IF it’s still floating, IF they can actually find it) is that foam core. Salt water is actually one of the most effective corrosives on the planet. Then, as now, everything else on board is junk metal (with barnacles) not fit for anything but the smelting pot.

    “I have no idea why Paul Watson chose now to disclose the intention to sue and why it was made so public.” – Ady Gil, from the above article.

    Well Ady, let me take a stab at this. Maybe Admiral Watson wanted to let people know that, while he is in the Southern Ocean Whale Sanctuary, issuing the whalers an ass-kicking of biblical proportions, you’re hiring lawyers. Lawyers whom, if they are successful, will undermine and inhibit future operations which could end Antarctic whaling, entirely. ‘Nuff said.

    “On October 26, 2010, I was badly insulted by a Sea Shepherd board member while trying to resolve this issue.” – Ady Gil

    Seriously? Seriously! Care to illuminate us on what this grievous insult was, that had you running to the law firm of Blah, Blah & Blah? Here it is, rich boy: I grew up in New Jersey (pronounced “Joisey”). If I hired a lawyer every time I was “badly insulted”, I’d still be going to court over crap that happened in the 8th grade. I got over it and moved on, without the benefit of millions of dollars to cry into. I suggest you cowboy-up and do the same.

    As far as the rest, Good Luck. Seriously. I hope things work out. And I hope Bethune works out for you. Considering what was shown on Whale Wars, you may want to save that lawyer money for the next damn-fool stunt he pulls. You’re going to need it.

    • Kent Sassen

      Is Pete Bethune a moron??

    • Andrew McGregor

      Michael Raymer is that your name? well what a nasty piece of work you are. “Admiral” ? you have got to be kidding. “Biblical proportions”? is that why the dragon boat has returned to Hobart ? you have them licked ? sure you do. Then you go and apologise like a sycophant for your first post full of untruths and spite. Did ‘someone’ suggest you apologise ? we cant have the SSCS looking bad now can we. Ady Gil is an honourable man and a decent man, he was conned used and abused and spat out by his holiness the ingrate Watson. There is a big glaring difference between Watson and Ady , Watson who isnt a captain let alone an admiral.. the difference is Ady Gil is a man of honour, decency, integrity and honesty. We can only hope that Pete treats him with the respect he deserves and does not use or con him as Watson did. I doubt he could be that unlucky.

      • Michael Raymer

        Now with the Nisshin Maru being found, I’ll go ahead and reply to this. Only because I’m in such a good mood.

        Andrew McGregor, is that YOUR real name? To answer your question, yes, Michael Raymer is my name. Any particular reason for asking?

        “well what a nasty piece of work you are.”

        Yes, yes I am. It might be a good idea to keep that in mind.

        “Then you go and apologise like a sycophant for your first post full of untruths and spite.”

        Wow, does it hurt that bad for you? I apologised to km because I realised how my post might look to a newcomer who doesn’t know me or how I do things. I apologised because km’s post was erudite and sincere and I figured that I should shift gears. What’s it to you?

        “Did ‘someone’ suggest you apologise ?”

        What on earth are you talking about?

        ” we cant have the SSCS looking bad now can we.”

        As long as they are in the Southern Ocean Whale Sanctuary, doing their best to shut down whaling operations, they really can’t “look bad”, can they?

        “Ady Gil is an honourable man and a decent man, he was conned used and abused and spat out by his holiness the ingrate Watson.”

        Show me. Show me something besides crybaby accusations. I keep asking and no one comes through.

        “Watson who isnt a captain let alone an admiral”

        Who is in charge of the “Steve Irwin”? Who gives orders to the other two ships?

        “the difference is Ady Gil is a man of honour, decency, integrity and honesty.”

        Who said he isn’t? I don’t know Ady Gil and I doubt you do either. I doubt you have ever heard of him until this little spat came up. If I’m wrong, how about some first-hand accounts of his sterling character? My remarks are based on the whining that he does in public on this issue alone. He can be a “man of honour, decency, integrity and honesty”, and still be a crybaby at the same time.

        “We can only hope that Pete treats him with the respect he deserves ”

        No, we can only hope that Pete keeps his pecker in his pocket and doesn’t get another boat sunk through his own arrogance and incompetence.

        Oh, and one more thing:

        “There is a big glaring difference between Watson and Ady ,”

        Yup, Watson…excuse me,….ADMIRAL Watson is in the Southern Ocean. Ady Gil is at his lawyers office.

    • oioioi

      Here is Watson in living colour stating loud and clear that Bethune followed orders. Watson is in charge of his fleet he and he alone gives the orders. Bethune obeyed the despot’s orders. But then those with more than one neurone already know this.

      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JFuc6nhBKMQ

  • km

    Michael,
    I don’t agree with that much of what you say. With that said, I am against the killing of all animals so I am on your side re whales and dolphins but not on the same page with you as you support the killing of other animals. In another thread, I believe you said that you don’t support everything that SSCS does and that made me view you as reasonable. But your comments here seem if not unreasonable but full of vitriol. I don’t necessarily support things that Ady and Pete have done but I can’t see how you attack Pete but support Paul? What about his stunts? And why insult Ady? Why the rich boy comment? How is that relevant? The guy has a legitimate claim and if someone on the SSCS board was dumb enough to say something to him while he was willing to work with him, then shouldn’t the criticism be against this board member or SSCS? Ady, whether worth a penny or a billion dollars, appears to have a claim. He didn’t publicize it. Paul Watson did. And Ady was being honest. Ecorazzzi asked him a question and he answered. I seriously don’t get all the anger on your part. By the way, your love for Watson and SSCS is quite evident here. Admiral? Ass-kicking of biblical proportion?
    And it is because of supporters like Ady that Paul can do what he does, whatever that is. Ady works and earned his money. Moreover, he just did his part in Taiji so he is fighting the fight too. You make some good comments and I learn from them at times but you lost me here.

    • Michael Raymer

      km, sorry for the vitriol. And I do admit to it. I knew how my post would come across, and I stand by it. But you have good reason to be turned off by it and I understand that.

      I was against the use of the “Ady Gil” from the start. Regardless of who spent the money, or how it was spent, I hated that overpriced piece of crap from the moment I learned of it. And then, last year panned out the way it did. And now, we have lawsuits and accusations. Please forgive my bitterness. The things mentioned in the above article have, “stirred the bitterness in my cup.” (as Tolkien would say)

      Beyond the fact that the “Ady Gil” should never have been deployed, what’s Ady Gil (the man) pissed off at Admiral Watson for? It was Pete’s actions that (indirectly) led to the collision. I’m not letting the “Shonan Maru” off the hook. But Bethune needs to admit his complicity for what happened and Gil needs to look at the evidence that was layed out right in front of him.

      Ady Gil stated (in the article) that being insulted by a (nameless) SSCS board member is his impetus for bringing a lawsuit against them. km, that is quite simply not good enough for me. We live in a day, age, culture that is being wiped out by crap lawsuits. Every hour after infinite hour that judges have to preside over this nonsense are hours they are not spending putting the guilty in jail and (just as importantly) letting the innocent go free. Are you OK with that?

      Current events time: SSCS are, as we speak, having their best year ever. Whales are still alive, RIGHT NOW, because they are doing a terrific job stopping the whalers. You would think that Ady Gil would be doing handsprings and giving his dog extra hugs. No. He is, in effect, allying himself with the whalers through is actions and/or threats of action. If he is smart enough to make millions, he should be smart enough to realize this. Either he doesn’t or he doesn’t care enough to think it through. In my opinion, this makes him fair game for me to nail him to the wall for it. And, getting back to this “insult” thing, he either needs to explain the specifics a whole lot better, let it go, or quit expecting an entirely sympathetic audience to come rushing to his corner. An insult is nothing more than sound waves and air.

      “And it is because of supporters like Ady that Paul can do what he does”

      Yup. But I don’t see Bob Barker kicking up a stink. Or anyone else, for that matter.

      Again, I apologize if my post offended you. I stand by my reasoning but I will keep your criticisms in mind, in the future.

      • km

        Michael – Thanks for the response. I get your passion and your response shows your integrity but I still can’t understand how you can criticize Pete and Ady but not see that Paul is the cause of it all. I truly believe that he brings down the organization not necessarily with his operations but with his mouth. He has made SSCS about him with his rants, “poetry”, personal attacks, lies, ego, you name it. It is embarrassing to watch and read. I thought what Pete did was too for the record. As for Paul, perhaps he is saving animals but he is hurting people and setting bad examples. If he truly cared about his cause, then he would be focused simply on the saving part.
        Pete clearly was partially responsible for the accident but I’d say that his whole crew share some responsibility, wouldn’t you? Wasn’t Laurens on that boat? He’s still with SSCS.
        If you think the Ady Gil was a mistake, what do you think about Gojira? The boat is in port and never engaged the NM and YM.
        As for the lawsuit, I agree that in this day and age, there are problems with how litigious we are but presumably Paul owes him some money. It is a valid claim and one that I get the sense Ady would have liked handled some other way. Instead of doing that, Paul or his Board member insulted him. They should be gracious not a**holes. Paul then posted about the suit BEFORE it was filed. And Paul is clearly not fighting the whalers 24/7 now. And how is Ady siding with the whalers? The personal battles with Pete and Ady are not only mostly Watson’s doing but they have nothing to do with the Whale Wars.
        And I hope to be proven wrong but what is successful about this campaign? The NM and at least one harpoon ship have been whaling happily this whole season. Twelve hours ago, Watson said they were running but how does he know that? It makes no sense. No one seems to know what is up with that tanker or with the NM fuel situation. It is all speculation.
        Again, I don’t agree with Pete’s actions and think he was reckless. But I respect that he and Ady came out against SSCS. If they were wronged, don’t they have a right to stand up for themselves? I don’t think they had much to gain by doing so and a lot to lose. At least Pete did.
        Rambling. Sorry. Again, I disagree with much of what you say but see your passion and your logic on certain things so am surprised by your views of Pete and Ady, especially as it all seems to stem from Paul. I think he thinks he is bulletproof (no pun intended) and he says what he says and people generally give him a free pass because they think he is the only one doing anything. He is in a position to do good, other than by saving whales, and he is pissing it way. It’s a shame.

      • http://www.herwinsvegancafe.com herwin

        Kim, you are so right, down to the last remark of Paul Watson pissing it away.
        While Paul Watson has the credit to make off the wall remarks, the danger is that his followers are talking the same bombastic way.
        I find it rather denigrating how Michael talks about Ady Gil, and quiet disapointing.

      • Michael Raymer

        Well, now it’s my turn to disagree with many of your points. Without going line by line:

        You say that Admiral Watson is hurting his own cause, in a variety of ways. Current events would suggest otherwise. The steady decline of the whalers has directly coincided with the steady growth of Sea Shepherd. And the results are right there in the news article below (among others). We are, in fact, looking at the end of Antarctic whaling. It may not be this year, or next. But it’s going to happen. And it’s going to happen the exact way Watson predicted. Through economic strangulation. I’d say that Admiral Watson is doing just fine.

        Bethune was the captain of the “Ady Gil”. He gave the order to stand down, with the Shonan Maru in direct proximity. He allowed the crew to relax their posture, while in imminent danger. Find any Navy man and ask him who is ultimately responsible for what happens on and to his ship.

        What do I think about “Gojira”? I don’t. I’m confident that they learned some valuable lessons from last year. I’m confident that there won’t be a repeat incident. Without knowing what money was involved with procuring/running “Gojira”, I still think there are better things to spend it on. But, I am not a member of SSCS, so my information is the same as yours.

        “Gojira” is in port because SSCS is staggering the refueling to keep one or more boats with the whalers. This was always the intention and I was actually quite relieved to read the article that Mick posted.

        I too am troubled about the Nisshin Maru and its escort harpoon ship being out of sight. What with the lack of updates on the SSCS site, I have the sinking feeling that they are, in fact, conducting whaling operations. This makes me sad but, the other side plays to win too.

        I’ve said what I wanted to say about the “insult” thing. If Ady wants to bring it up, he needs to provide specifics as to the actual insult and the context of the overall discussion before I get weak in the knees over it.

        It’s your opinion that the conflict between Watson and Gil/Bethune are Watson’s fault. I disagree. Either way, the fact that this conflict has gone public is completely the fault of Gil/Bethune. Bethune went public first and Gil publicly sided with him. They both could have picked up their football and quietly went home. They didn’t. And they have plenty to gain. As Admiral Watson has said himself, “Any publicity is good publicity.” And that’s what this fight is. An attempt to gain publicity for their fledgling organisation.

        This is the second time today I’ve had to swing at someone who I consider an ally, and it’s wearing me out. I found this site and decided to keep coming back because I want to articulate the anti-whaling side of the debate. I wanted to make it difficult for the people who, in my opinion, are just trying to make Watson and SSCS an easy target for ignorant accusations and muckraking. I’ve lost enemies but, it seems, I’ve lost friends too. This troubles me. Georgina, MN with Hope, imforthewhales, Hufingraz….I don’t see them anymore. I wish I did, mainly because I’d let them carry much more of the debate and keep quiet a greater percentage of the time. Even crumpets seems to have gone AWOL, and that sux. Please believe me when I say that I actually hate seeing my name so much on the “Recent Comments” tab. And now I’m scuffling with another team member. I’m tired.

      • km

        Michael, fair enough. I don’t mean to antagonize you. Enjoy the rest of your weekend.

      • Michael Raymer

        km, you did not antagonize me in any way. I enjoyed the debate. As long as we can focus on the core issues without getting too sidetracked, we can agree to disagree on the side issues. In fact, you gave me things to think about and that’s always a good thing.

        Enjoy your weekend too.

    • Michael Raymer

      UPDATE!!!

      http://www.smh.com.au/environment/whale-watch/japans-whaling-fleet-on-the-run-20110121-19zyl.html

      Excerpts:

      “Three black ships of the Sea Shepherd Conservation Society took up positions around a red fuel tanker and escorted it out of the Antarctic. Skulking in their wakes were two of the three harpoon-equipped whale hunter ships in the Japanese fleet.”

      “Now that the Sea Shepherd ships had locked on to the tanker Sun Laurel, the conservationists claimed to have found the fleet’s Achilles heel. If Nisshin Maru could not refuel, Japan’s whalers would have to cut their season short.”

      “They had to share official blame for the Ady Gil shipwreck and were forced to apologise for running a whale-meat black market. In the legal trade the Japanese consumer appetite for their product is at best lukewarm.”

      “However, he believes the Institute of Cetacean Research is in difficult financial straits. Two years ago, the Japanese fleet was seven ships strong. This year it has four. The whalers were also three weeks late reaching the Antarctic, and plan a much shorter season.”

      “On top of this short-term financial squeeze looms a greater strategic problem. The heavy fuel oil used by Nisshin Maru will be outlawed in the Antarctic by the International Maritime Organisation from August. The institute has given no indication of its intentions but Japan is one of the world’s leading maritime nations and is regarded as highly compliant.

      The 23-year-old Nisshin Maru may need a multimillion-dollar refit, or a government decision could be forced on whether to replace it. This is a nightmare scenario for whaling’s opponents, who see a new ship as entrenching the industry for decades.”

      “The Institute of Cetacean Research describes Sea Shepherd as ”terroristic”. But in technique its leader, Paul Watson, has more in common with Julius Caesar than al-Qaeda. Leading from the front, he besieges whaling. He believes the best way to end the hunt is to strangle its resources, and the rope appears to be tightening.”

      …..and then there’s Ady Gil.

      • Hufingraz

        Michael,
        I am back, but I doubt you are going to like what I have to say.
        Just because Paul says Sea Shepherd is having the best year ever, doesn’t mean it is actually true. Sea Shepherd has had a tail for the entire season. The Nisshin Maru & at least one harpoon vessel have been happily hunting for over 25 days. According to Paul statistics from previous years, one harpoon vessel can kill 10 whales a day. So theoretically, the Japanese could have already killed over 250 whales. Gojira(the vessel that was going to win the whale war) hasn’t found shit. I have also heard a rumour that the Sun Laurel is a decoy and that the Nisshin has already re-fueled. So exactly how is Sea Shepherd winning the whale war this season? Until Sea Shepherd finds and stays with the Nisshin, the only thing Sea Shepherd can be confident in, is the fact that whales are dying.
        I have lost all respect for Paul Watson. He claimed from the day SS found the harpoon vessels, that they were “following” the Nisshin, which was total bullshit. SS had no idea where the Nisshin was, and they still don’t. Paul is a big, fat liar, and I am done financially supporting his organization.

      • km

        That’s it. While I don’t agree with any lying, I can understand some of Paul’s lies like not stating that the Gojira was coming back for repairs. I understand he wants the whalers to think they are out there. That is strategy. But to say the whalers are running and not whaling is speculation and mostly likely a lie and it cannot be argued that it provides any strategic advantage other than to mislead the public and donors and cause them to donate more money. Isn’t that fraud? Again, Paul should keep his mouth shut some times. They have two harpoon ships and a presumed tanker. Leave it at that. Perhaps he is starting to believe his “no compromise” and “whaling ends today” hype.

      • Michael Raymer

        *Sigh* Here we go again.

        “The Nisshin Maru & at least one harpoon vessel have been happily hunting for over 25 days.”

        ” I have also heard a rumour that the Sun Laurel is a decoy and that the Nisshin has already re-fueled.”

        Proof please. I have looked all over the place and I see no evidence of anyone “happily hunting”. Apparently you have sources unknown to me. Share them please. And where did your “rumor” come from? Tell the truth, was it one of romika’s “contacts”? Swing and a miss.

        “He claimed from the day SS found the harpoon vessels, that they were “following” the Nisshin, which was total bullshit.”

        Y’know, if you are going to call someone else a liar, it’s a bit counter-productive to be caught lying yourself, Huf. I just went through all the SSCS press releases and I see no mention of them “following” the Nisshin Maru. They are pursuing, they are chasing. But I see nothing that could be interpreted as them “following” the Nisshin. Strike two.

        From the SSCS website: “Behind the two Sea Shepherd ships in plain sight are the Yushin Maru # 1 and Yushin Maru #2.” Aren’t these two ships whaling vessels? Are they whaling? Wouldn’t having them in sight classify them as “found”? Strike three! Aaaaand, you’re out!

      • km

        Michael, not disagreeing with your other comments but unfair to ask someone for proof that the Japanese are happily hunting. Unlike SSCS, they aren’t in the habit of advertising their every move. It would be odd for the Japanese to issue a release stating that they are hunting. In the past how many ever years they’ve been whaling, whales were killed and the Japanese didn’t issue press releases. Unless weather is an issue or the whales aren’t there or something else is happening, it is reasonable to assume they are hunting. That is after all what they are there for. Hopefully the numbers are low but we won’t know until the season is over and they do their usual report.

        As for the Gojira, eh. I think Paul has made comments on Facebook suggesting otherwise. On twitter now is this: “Nisshin Maru and 3rd harpoon boat continue to run”
        If he doesn’t know where they are, how can he state they are running? He implies that they are following in most of his releases.

        Again, I’m not discounting their successes just wondering why all the lies and speculation.

      • Michael Raymer

        I think it is fair to ask someone to back up their accusations with proof. I have been on this site for a good while now and there are way too many unsubstantiated remarks, now and in the past. It’s an epidemic, really. There are also too many statements made that show lack of knowledge concerning maritime operations, Antarctic operations, running a campaign without going to jail and so on. Too many of these statements are made as fact rather than opinion. I won’t claim that every post I’ve ever made was an objective and factual gem, but I make the effort to keep the BS to a minimum. I do this by attaching links and attributable quotes and I encourage others to do the same.

        You make an entirely valid remark about the whalers not giving away their moves. Yet when Admiral Watson does the same (let’s just call it what it is: misinformation with the intent of deceiving your enemy), he gets instantly slam-dunked for it. And he gets it from people who should be on his side.

        I have said it many times and so have others: When I see someone else deploying ships to the Southern Ocean Whale Sanctuary, using tactics that saves the lives of actual whales, and they do it better than SSCS, I’ll switch allegiance in less than 3 seconds flat. SSCS, led by Paul Watson, is currently the only game in town. And the IRC itself has stated that SSCS is inhibiting their ability to kill whales.

        For all this talk about how Watson is a liar and he is deceiving people? He has said it on camera and said it in print: His clients are the whales. He answers to no one but the whales. He has made himself very clear on this point. And there he is, right now, in the Southern Ocean Whale Sanctuary, fulfilling the only promise he has to keep. His promise to the whales.

        It really is beyond my comprehension how you people don’t get that.

      • km

        There are ridiculous people who post here against SSCS. I agree. In this case though, I think it’s fair to assume they are whaling and the burden is on Paul to prove otherwise if he states they aren’t. If he said nothing, then his lies/speculation wouldn’t be an issue.

        I don’t buy that his only clients are the whales. His ego is huge. He wants to be a hero. I understand the television show but his writings suggest that he’s after something more selfish too. It’s that narcissism which detracts from his mission. And his lies.

        I think if you want to people to respect your position that their direct action is the only way to save whales then you should respect other people’s positions that Greenpeace or lobbying or praying or whatever is the only way. I think you probably do but Paul doesn’t. Greenpeace said their piece re SSCS’s actions and usually only comment when attacked. They were there before Paul so they’re speaking from experience. They decided that what they were doing was no longer the path they wanted to follow. They were in the Med with the Bluefin. They must still support direct action but no longer in the Southern Ocean. They put in their time. Whether right or wrong, they don’t affirmatively go out and attack SSCS as Paul does to everyone who doesn’t support him. Look at Taiji. There are about five different groups doing five different things. Who’s to say what is right or wrong.

        To me, the bottom line is if the whales are his only clients and if all that matters is physically stopping the whaling, then he should minimize his talking about anything else besides that or related to that. Stop insulting the Japanese, the Makah, Greenpeace, Black Fish, the Australian Government, my dog, whomever. Act like a soldier in a war. Focus on the mission at hand. Memoirs and the like are fine. I think his movie will be interesting because what he has done is interesting not because he is. Why diminish that?

      • Michael Raymer

        “his writings suggest that he’s after something more selfish too. It’s that narcissism which detracts from his mission.”

        He lives on the same 24 hour clock that you and are on. Me? I’m playing a strategy game I like. Paul writes. If you were on a ship in the middle of the ocean and it’s going to take close to 2 weeks to even find the whalers….what would you be doing? I’m sorry but I find no validity in your criticism. It’s not for us to tell a guy how to spend his free time.

        The Greenpeace thing has been discussed in recent threads. I’m not blowing you off but constantly repeating the same things is wearing on me (and I have my game to get back to). One point you raised though: Greenpeace was NOT there before Paul. Whether or not you believe he was a founding member (I do), he was there from the start. And, looking at it another way, since most of the current leadership of Greenpeace either wasn’t there or wasn’t even born yet, Paul has vastly more experience than Greenpeace does.

        Leadership and ego go hand in hand. The vast majority of military leaders had massive egos to go along with their successes. MacArthur, Patton, Montgomery all had big egos. Bradley didn’t but he was a very definite exception. Again, how anyone would support the killing of whales because they have taken a personal dislike to the person trying to stop it is beyond my comprehension.

        “And his lies.” What lies? You people keep calling him a liar without illustrating what it is he is lying about. Since you bring it up, what lies of his have you so troubled? Could you please be specific? What lies of his are so damning that he should just pull the plug on Operation No Compromise, order his ships into port and allow the whalers to conduct operations unopposed?

        Y’know, the U.S. once formed an alliance with the Soviet Union. This alliance would result in 50 years of heartburn, strife, conflict and trillions of dollars wasted on crap that we still don’t know how to get rid of. Yet the alliance was necessary to defeat Nazi Germany. Ask any WWII expert to paint a picture, where this alliance did not occur, and take a good look at that picture. Everyone want Watson to be exactly who they want him to be rather than who he is. Every little box that doesn’t have a check mark in it results in a tidal wave of condemnation. Me? I just want him to save whales.

      • km

        So you believe he was shot? You’re comfortable that accusing someone of attempted murder is saving whales? Your last sentence says it all. Just save whales.
        Do you believe he saved 528 whales last season although he was with the whaling fleet less than half the season?
        Do you support his raising money for the Ady Gil and then not giving the amount raised to Ady and Pete?
        As for his writings, I understand him wanting to write. And he clearly has that right. I can’t explain my feelings well so will drop it. Moreover, if you see him as a military leader then can’t go further because whatever I say won’t convince you.
        I don’t support the killing of whales because I dislike Paul. I support what other groups are doing. I guess I could say to you that Paul’s actions are hurting the whaling movement in the long term so that you must also support killing whales by supporting him. Except I wouldn’t say that because that’s not fair.
        Maybe my information re GP is wrong so thank you for correcting me. I know they were there in 05-06. I don’t know if they were there before that and I guess you’re saying that SSCS was. I’ll take your word for it. And I agree that he may be older than people in GP but their organization was there and made a decision to leave. Didn’t SSCS do the same in Taiji? They once cut nets and now they are “Cove Guardians.” Not only that, they criticize Black Fish for doing what they did with cutting nets.
        If I understand you correctly, you really think SSCS’s way is the only way to save whales. I can totally see that and I struggle with each life lost but Paul makes me struggle with the other examples he is setting and the hatred he spews and I don’t support violence.
        As an aside, and maybe something you’ll consider, but how can you be so vocal and opposed to whaling and still eat meat? To have so much (com)passion and for that not to extend to other animals baffles me. I am not diminishing your position, just hoping to plant a seed. :)

      • Michael Raymer

        You’re coming in somewhat late to the game. A lot of these discussions have already been had, repeatedly (hence my reticence about repeating them more). Unfortunately, this site does not lend itself to easy reading of previous discussions. Did Paul get shot? I am so past the point of caring, I really am. I have said previously that I have my doubts, but I no longer care.

        The ICR itself says that SSCS is getting in their way and they’ve even gone as far as to try to have SSCS tax exempt status revoked. Hey, if you don’t want to believe your friends, go ahead and believe your enemies.

        I don’t see where SSCS was “raising money for Ady Gil”. It’s SSCS that’s trying to raise money. Ady is a millionaire. What does he need someone to raise money for him for?

        I don’t necessarily see Watson as a “military” leader, but the comparison is valid. That’s why I used it. Find whomever you like who is in a similar non-military role and check out what their ego is like.

        Pauls actions aren’t hurting the anti-whaling movement, long term or short term, so I’m not worried about how he affects the other conservation groups.

        You seem to be very interested in this topic so I have to recommend that you take the time to thoroughly check out the websites for Sea Shepherd, Greenpeace, Ocean Defenders, Blackfish and any others you can find. But read through the whole sites. History, Board of Directors, past campaigns, the full smash. I say this as a friend who is having a great time discussing this with you: Don’t count on me to give you the answers you desire. Go to the source(s) and make up your own mind. I’m as biased as anyone you are going to find in here and you deserve better. And if you have the time (and a whole lot of patience), read the past threads here. You may want to first train for this by watching spider monkeys throw feces at each other, but other than that, it may be an entertaining and educational experience for you (said one of the spider monkeys).

        It is common knowledge, or it should be, that there are SSCS volunteers, on board the ships right now, that aren’t vegans or vegetarians. The cuisine served onboard is vegan only, but there is no requirement for sticking to it while on shore. (SSSHHHHH….don’t tell herwin. Her head may literally explode if she finds out.) I actually get a kick imagining a dozen or so crewmembers windsprinting to the nearest steakhouse the moment their ship is tied up, after an extended cruise.

        I’ll say what I said over on the Sting thread. Do not think that vegetarianism and veganism don’t have their own serious consequenses for the environment. On several levels. If the world woke up tomorrow and decided to become 100% vegan, those consequences would become very apparent, very quickly. There’s no way I’m going to attempt to type them all out (especially here), but they are very real. But please (after yesterdays fiasco I will say, please, Please, for the love of GOD, PLEASE) don’t misunderstand me. I have nothing but support for YOUR choice to be vegan and everyone elses. Convince and convert others to your hearts content and I will be on your side every step of the way. But it’s not my choice and I’m OK with it. And if I’m a total hypocrite, I’m OK with that too.

      • http://www.herwinsvegancafe.com herwin

        Quote Michael :
        “The cuisine served onboard is vegan only, but there is no requirement for sticking to it while on shore. (SSSHHHHH….don’t tell herwin. Her head may literally explode if she finds out.)”

        you really seem to get all nasty if you dont have any argument left.

        Its perfectly okay to be anti whaling and passionately defend whales and be a non veggie.
        Where did i ever say the opposite ?

        Its you who starts with your wacky theory that dolphins are inteligent and cows and pigs are not and so make the assumption that its okay to eat pigs and cows because they are too dumb.
        Next you start explaining why its okay to cut a lobster in half and fry it.
        Completely nonsense, both scientific (lobsters DO feel pain and pigs ARE very smart just as cows) as well as ethical.

        Next time simply stick to whales and dolphins, and dont bring in cows, pigs, chickens, and lobsters int the anti whaling topic so i or another vegan wont have to correct to such nonsense.

        I strongly am beginning to think your compassion doesnt ly with ANY animals (including whales and dolphins) but simply a compassion for a nice war, a nice fight, eh, to boost your ego.

        Whats nicer than to have a cyber war and proof all these guys, pro whaling guys and all the anti whaling people whith a mind of their own, that you know it better, lets kick their butt , eh.
        You are such a hero, against your will, of course.

        And here is a little suggestion for you. You as a meateater cant play the ethical card for oposing whaling. You’ll loose. You better follow the argument of Sea Shepherd and stick to the environmental argument about hunting endangered and protected animals.

        Another suggestion, dont go trashing veganism, it makes you look bad and it makes the pro whalers look a bit better, compared to you.
        Remember, this is a green website, many veggies, you know…you are not with your McDonald pals now.

        Okay, and dont forget, i had to respond because for some dark and unknown reason you had to mention and ridicule my name in your post, even there was no need for it.

        Okay, this will be fun the coming weeks watching the pro whaler thugs and the anti whaler people who you are so briliantly insulting and alianating, mash you up, New “Joisey” boy…
        Enjoy the clogged arteries in later life…
        and when this is over, the best friends of you will be David and the other forum trolls, come to think of it, at least you can have dinner with these guys and talk trash about vegans who think that COWS and PIGS are inteligent. You might even team up with them and start trolling vegan forums. That must be fun for you, at least it would fit with your thug personality and your way of thinking as you have expressed regarding veganism.

        Its not too late though before turning into your own nightmare, please think what arguments you best can use, and try to expand your compassion to other animals as well.

      • http://www.herwinsvegancafe.com herwin

        Michael, you argued that cows and pigs cannot be compared with dolphins when it comes to inteligence, and so its justifiable to eat cows and pigs, and even cut lobsters in half and BBQ them alive, but we cant eat dolphins.

        How about shark finning ? Sharks are even less clever than cows and pigs, so following your line of reasoning, finning sharks should be okay.

        I suspect you are also against shark finning, so that makes your whole line of previous arguments very shaky.

        Isnt it just because whaling and shark finning are animal cruelties that are part of somebodie elses culture, and you simply refuse to selfreflect and even justify the massive animal cruelties from our own western culture that only can continue thanks to guys like you with their “cows and pigs are dumb and so can be eaten” attitude, and i am refering to the animal factories.

        In the case that you are not against shark finning, then your arguments are proven to be consistent but in that case there is a whle diferent can of wurms waiting for you.

      • Hufingraz

        Michael,

        I constantly cruise the pro-whaling Facebook pages such as the Shonan’s, Nisshin, and many others. There are several pro-whaling forums out there too. I don’t believe everything I read on the pro-whaling sites, or the ICR. Just like I don’t believe everything I read on the anti-whaling sites, or Sea Shepherd’s official site. It was on one of the pro-whaling sites that I have heard that the Nisshin & one of the Yushin’s is happily hunting. That is also where I heard the rumour about the Sun Laurel being a decoy. These are just rumours, but who is to say they are not true? Only time will tell.

        Now as far as calling me a liar, what have I lied about? On December 31st, 2010, Paul Watson posted on the SS website —> Sea Shepherd Hunts Down the Japanese Whalers Before a Single Whale is Killed. Paul had zero proof that a single whale was not killed before they found the fleet. I had actually heard that the Japanese where hunting for about a week before SS found them.
        On January 1st, 2011, Paul posted on SS’s website that “Sea Shepherd’s ships are chasing the slower factory ship the Nisshin Maru, while the faster Japanese harpoon vessels are chasing after Sea Shepherd’s fleet.” Sorry, I was wrong, he didn’t say following, he said chasing. Same difference. In the same article, Paul said “Nancy Burnet, is hot on the tracks of that floating abattoir the Nisshin Maru.” How does Paul know they were hot on the tracks of the Nisshin, if they actually had no idea where the Nisshin was? Same article Paul states, “The entire Japanese whaling fleet is on the run, and when they are running they are not killing whales.”. Where is Paul’s proof that the entire fleet is on the run? Why would the Nisshin run, if the Yushin’s were relaying SS’s coordinates?
        If Paul knew where the Nisshin was, you can be guaranteed that he wouldn’t be chasing around a unknown supply vessel.
        Paul is being deceptive to his supporters, and if you can’t see that or accept that, then it is no skin off my back. I just can’t give money to an organization that is being deceptive to it’s supporters. Paul being deceptive is also not a strategy. It is just a way for him to try and suck more money out of his supporters.

      • Michael Raymer

        herwin, do you even read what I write, or do you have some grievance with me based on events in a past life? Seriously, what on earth is your problem? Since you bring up David, read his latest posts and now read yours. It’s a damn shame that he comes off as much more rational than you do. And for Pete’s sake, invest in a Spell Check. I’m still getting over “faraway Corea” and now you come up with “can of wurms”? Really? I went to public school too, but I managed to overcome it.

        Please copy/paste where I “trash” vegans. Either do so or stop talking to me. Well…stop talking to me anyway. I find you boring and unworthy of further conversation. I was having a nice discussion with km, and here you come with your obtuse brand of hysteria and half-assed writing style, contributing absolutely nothing. Where have you ever gotten the notion that I have to explain myself to you? And where do you get the notion that I have to respond to your stunning hypocrisy? You recently aimed a shot at me for “attacking other peoples eating habits.” What have you been doing to me over the last two days but attacking MY eating habits? You get all shaky and concerned over me attacking Ady Gil, so please explain your persistent attacks against me. And now you go so far as accuse me of looking for a “nice fight”. Sweetie, I’m old enough to know that “nice fight” is a mutually exclusive term. How about you?

        There is an old saying, “Never get into a battle of wits with an unarmed person.” Learn how to spell, think about what you want to say, check what you wrote before you hit “Submit” and for crying out loud, calm down. If your conduct over the last couple of days is indicative of how you try to change peoples minds, veganism has a long way to go.

      • Michael Raymer

        Hey Huf, I just saw your post. I’ve been a bit busy fighting off a rabid poodle who keeps trying to bite my ankle.

        Anyway, unlike others, I read what others write and I read what you have to say. I think it basically comes down to the fact that we read things a different way. You are interpreting Watson’s words one way and I’m interpreting them another. We will have to agree to disagree about it.

        For the record, I am becoming a bit concerned myself. The pictures I’ve seen of the “Sun Laurel”,….it seems to be a bit small for a resupply vessel. And not having the Nisshin Maru in sight is getting more troubling with every passing day. I am starting to temper my earlier enthusiasm. But I also realize that the only info either of us has comes in the way of internet updates and conjecture, both of whom contain their own bias. As you say, only time will tell.

        I will say this: If the ICR is running a con on SSCS, it’s a pretty elaborate and expensive one. And you don’t go to all this trouble for someone who is having no effect on your operations. Also, the ICR would be putting the clamps on anyone trying to spill the beans about it. This is the Southern Ocean we’e talking about. The place is a bit short on objective eyewitnesses.

      • km

        Michael – I understand your position re vegan. I wouldn’t suggest it to everyone but your passion for whales just made you an easy target to try and recruit. :) I also agree that being vegan is not without other issues. Would I love to see everyone stop eating animals? Most definitely but as it won’t happen then I am careful as to who I suggest it to. To others I just suggest buying cruelty free products when possible. End of subject for me.

        Did you see what GP did in Taiwan today? Or there campaign in Asia on the Rainbow Warrior? Any thoughts? Honest question, not me attacking or defending GP.

        As for Pete and Paul, there apparently is a lot of drama on Facebook now where Paul is unfriending people who are friends with Pete and criticizing Pete because Pete is commenting on Paul’s strategy. Not taking sides, but if there were no show and if Paul was just focused on the whales, then none of this would be happening. I realize the show is for awareness but Paul supposedly doesn’t care about awareness because he believes his direct action is the only way to stop whaling. So it brings him fame and the organization some more money. There is nothing wrong with that but he puts his actions in the public domain by calling reporters, tweeting and posting Facebook updates. If it’s strictly about strategy, why is he posting anything? Makes no sense to me. Unlike governments of countries at war who are worried about PR so they issue releases, Paul says his clients are the whales and what the Japanese think doesn’t matter so why publicize all his actions? I’m think out loud but there is such a glaring disconnect in what he says and what he does and that fact that he never admits he was wrong. I think he could do such good but doesn’t take advantage of it. It’s unfortunate really.

      • Hufingraz

        Michael,
        I also hope that the rumours are not true. But I have a sneaky suspicion that we are all underestimating the Japanese. It is like you said, SS is having a huge negative effect on Japan’s “research” program and costing them hundreds of millions. So wouldn’t it be beneficial to hire a supply ship(with no supplies or fuel), and let Sea Shepherd “find” it, which wouldn’t be hard considering the whalers have known SS’s location since the New Year. Then take them on a wild goose chase far from the whaling grounds and the Nisshin. As I said, I hope it is not true, but for some reason I think we are still in for a shock from the whalers, once the Nisshin is discovered(if it is discovered).

      • Michael Raymer

        Hi km,
        First of all, before I forget, I would like to sincerely thank you for the civil and constructive conversation we have been having. I would appreciate it anyway but, in light of recent events, I am even more appreciative. Thanks again.

        I’m just popping in for a look before I continue with a busy day, so I’m a bit out of the loop. Tomorrow I’ll be able to catch up (maybe).

        Whatever is happening on Facebook, Paul is on his own with it. I actually am not an SSCS or Watson apologist, despite appearances. I hated Facebook and recently cancelled my account. If Paul is being cheap and cheesy, he can face the consequences for it. While I have made my own cracks, I too find this situation regrettable if not deplorable, the more so because it has become so public. And Paul may be completely wrong in his approach. I’m not wading back into Facebook to find out. Sorry. I read through your last post and find nothing to disagree or debate with. It’s up to Watson to stay on the high ground and practice what he preaches.

        I’ll check on the GP thing ASAP. I have nothing against them, per se. I just don’t like the way they come across, i.e. We’re Saving Whales, Donate Now. SSCS obviously solicits donations also, but not on every page that you click on.

        Hi Huf,
        All I can say is you may be right. We will continue to hope that you are not. But I’m worried.

        Sorry about the “lying” thing in my previous post. You are civil and educated and you don’t need that sort of thing from me. We both see things our own way and can disagree without becoming acrimonious. It won’t happen again.

      • Hufingraz

        Michael,
        Thank you. Now the good news is, SS has found the Nisshin Maru. The bad news is that the Japanese were hunting and were actually processing a whale when SS found them. It now also looks like the Sun Laurel was a decoy. But at least SS has found the Nisshin. That is all that matters now. As long as SS can stay with the Nisshin for the rest of the season, alot of whales are going to be saved and Japan is going to lose boatloads of money.

  • Devon McDonald

    Paul Watson is such a fraud that I’m surprised more people aren’t going after him.

    • boo radley

      Lol, Paul Watson is so good at what he does, its a wonder there are not more people following him.

      Sorry but Pete and Ady Gil have just been riding on Paul Watson’s coat-tails and they know it. Sure they want some recognition and sure their egos have suffered a bit of damage but neither of them are a Paul Watson and they may as well get used to it. They may have helped the organization but they never were the organization,and that is a big difference.

      Will be interesting to see how Pete Bethune carries off his Faroes campaign. Good luck to him there but he has many years to go before people will start respecting him in the same way that they respect Paul Watson who has been there, done that.

    • Mr Philips

      And who are you Devon? What do you do? Have you saved a life today, or done anything of note?
      Or do you spend your life hanging on the sidelines shouting fraud, every time someone acts on their passions and beliefs?

      • David

        You don’t have to be a bank robber to know one when you see one. And you don’t need to be using ‘direct action’ to be saving animals.

      • Michael Raymer

        ” And you don’t need to be using ‘direct action’ to be saving animals.”

        Yeah, but it helps. Direct action saves actual whales. Which whales? The ones who don’t have a harpoon sticking out of them. Political action and passive protest may have some long term viability but, that is small comfort for the whale that gets harpooned today.

  • Mick

    “ANTI-whaling vessel Gojira has arrived back in Hobart.”

    http://www.themercury.com.au/article/2011/01/23/202051_tasmania-news.html

    According to this news article, the Gojira has docked in Hobart,Tasmania.

    • boo radley

      Yes news is it will be in dock for some time. I hope they make it out there again.

      • http://www.herwinsvegancafe.com herwin

        the last sentence should be

        “No compromise with whalers or no compromise about one’s anti whaling principles or tactics, i fully share that, and thats what makes Seashepherd so special and so effective.”

  • Kai

    Hey all,

    At the end of the day many people are blinded by Sea Shepherd, Whale Wars and all of the hype and bullshit that goes with it. If the facts and the truth about Paul Watson and his organisation was to come out it would leave people worldwide disgusted and appalled. “The squeaky wheel gets the grease” as they say. Lies, propaganda and misinformation get attention. The ones who ARE working hard to end the situation in Antarctica, Taiji, etc are the ones behind the scenes doing the real work of changing governments, people and traditions through respect, understanding and offering viable alternatives.

    Anyone can alter the truth to suit their cause and for me Sea Shepherd are a cause that I supported for a very long time with all of my heart and soul until I saw what they actually were and how they went about their business. At that moment I had to walk away. Please do your research people and don’t believe everything that you hear…

    • AnimuX

      Seems to me that whenever these interpersonal issues and opinions of Watson and Sea Shepherd come up they have little or nothing to do with the cause of stopping whaling.

      I also find it particularly amusing when people talk about “the ones who ARE working hard to end the situation in Antarctica, Taiji, etc” without any reference at all to the very real impact Sea Shepherd has made over the last 30 years.

      Read any book about the history of modern whaling and you’ll find Sea Shepherd and Watson up against the Soviets, Iceland, Norway, (most effectively) pirate whalers in various parts of the world, and later Japan.

      Not that there is anything wrong with attempting to influence governments, Project Jonah worked out quite well for Australia, but the moratorium on commercial whaling started in 1986 and here we are, watching quotas rise as governments negotiate a compromise rather than enforce the vote that Iceland, Norway and Japan lost in 1982.

      Sea Shepherd is getting results where diplomacy and international resolutions have failed.

      I sincerely doubt that people who get offended by Watson, or Sea Shepherd then decide an over dramatic legal and publicity competition is going to resolve the whaling conflict.

      What we have here is a perfect example of why subversive groups working for a good cause should not become dependent on a small number of big donors.

      • http://www.herwinsvegancafe.com herwin

        “I sincerely doubt that people who get offended by Watson, or Sea Shepherd then decide an over dramatic legal and publicity competition is going to resolve the whaling conflict”

        To me it seems more that Seashepherd is doing the public competition. Just look how Seashepherd challenges Greenpeace al the time, or simply trashes them, publicly, and for many years.

        And it was also Watson who made the legal move of Ady Gil public, by putting it on Facebook.
        All in all, the way Seashepherd treats people, including donors who poor in much money and lend their name and repuation, will scare away potential donors.

        Who wants to donate much money and repuation , only to risk that later you will be insulted in private, agreements go down the drain and make you force to get the help of laywers, and be trashed publicly ?

        Don’t bite the hand that feeds you, that means dont piss on donors and supporters, big or small, we all want whaling to stop.

      • AnimuX

        First, public disagreement between Sea Shepherd and Greenpeace goes both ways and isn’t an isolated problem. In fact, even Greenpeace Foundation doesn’t respect Greenpeace USA for several good reasons.

        Second, Sea Shepherd has more satisfied contributors, big and small, today than any other point in its long history. The organization puts the vast majority of its donations into operational costs instead of administrative overhead and is making progress toward its goals. Unfortunately, some individual egos can’t seem to handle “giving” without ships bearing their name like a giant seaborne advertising campaign.

        Donations are not tickets to fame. You donate to a cause, not your own name.

      • http://www.herwinsvegancafe.com herwin

        @ Animux
        First, the latest Sheashepherd versus Greenpeace public scuffle was (as usual) started by Seashepherd, who publicly challenged them to join the anti whaling campaign in Antarctice. Asd far as i know, these scuffles are a one way street, traffic coming from Seashepherd avenue.

        Second. You are right that there is little overhead and most go directly to campaigns.
        And yeah, with their own international TV show, its very normal that there are more people giving donations than ever.
        But at the end i have to disagree with you. What happened is simply a sponsor deal, a mutaul agreement, (and not a free donation) between Seashepherd and Ady Gil.
        Paul gets a flashy boat, and Ady Gil gets his name painted on the boat, there is nothing wrong with that.
        It is however wrong, both ethically as well as legally, if one party dont hold its end of the bargain and gets abusive, and instead of trying to settle things in private, publish it all on Facebook. Why ? Nothing positive comes from it, only trouble.
        What i read from Ady Gil , he seems a reasonable person. What i read from Paul Watson, he seems a lot less reasonable sometimes. No compromise with whalers or no compromise about one’s anti whaling principles or tactics. But with (former) friends or donors or allies or ex members, you HAVE to compromise sometimes and NOT start a war.

      • AnimuX

        Whatever. You may be OK with wealthy egocentric donors holding charity funded organizations hostage but that doesn’t make it OK.

        Ady Gil and Pete Bethune don’t run Sea Shepherd and they never will. It’s about time everybody arguing on their behalf get that through their heads and move on.

      • http://www.herwinsvegancafe.com herwin

        @ Animux. Ady Gil wasnt a donor, he was a sponsor. He made a legal deal with Seashepherd. Both parties should honor their end of the deal, so Like it or not, he is in his full rights.

    • Michael Raymer

      Kai writes:

      ” If the facts and the truth about Paul Watson and his organisation was to come out it would leave people worldwide disgusted and appalled.”

      OK, well we’re waiting. If you would like to deal in “facts and truth”, how about laying some on us? Please? Pretty please. Or do you just want to sit there and froth at the mouth?

      ” Lies, propaganda and misinformation get attention.”

      Well, you’ve got mine.

      “The ones who ARE working hard to end the situation in Antarctica, Taiji, etc are the ones behind the scenes doing the real work of changing governments, people and traditions through respect, understanding and offering viable alternatives.”

      Holy crap! I just want to see whaling come to an end. You’re trying to change governments, change PEOPLE and change traditions? Behind the scenes? Maybe romika really DOES have a Super-Sleuth Spy Network. Jeez, and you guys call SSCS invasive.

      “Please do your research people”

      I’m trying but I keep getting distracted by people like you.

      • boo radley

        kai= greenp*ss supporter who thinks SS are the enemy and GP are actually doing something positive with their origami whale campaign. tsk tsk.

  • cristal

    None of you know what really is going on. You are not there. So before you all start calling paul a fraud and a big fat liar, wait till the campaign is over. In the mean time show this awesome man some support. Innocent until proven guilty.

    p.s. Ady and Pete i love u guys and i hate the ways things turned out.

    • http://www.herwinsvegancafe.com herwin

      Paul and Seashepherd are just awsome and if they werent there, OMG, the whaling would NEVER stop until the last whale had been harpooned.
      Thats not only my opinion its also the opinion of the Japanese, as we all could read in the leaked wiki cables.:-P

      And now we have another team of great guys fighting the battle in Tokyo itself and trying to bring the anti dolphin slaughter topic to the japanese people itself.
      Its getting better and better…:-)

  • mariner

    Oh guys – geez come on.

    We all need to unite to fight the whalers – this inner bickering is just such a time waster and exactly what the whaling lobby wants!

  • Mkay

    I recently talked to Pete and he confirmed from some of the crew that the SSCS was indeed following the tanker for nothing as the whalers have already refueled and have continuesd hunting unabated. There is also talk of an additional harpoon vessel that is with them and guess what, it’s not from Japan! Way to waste that fuel, but then again, who cares – it wasn’t their money anyways, right?

    • boo radley

      Lots of talk, so very little of it credible. Fun times for the pro whalers though!

    • vince

      The Japanese Whale Research Program under Special Permit in the Antarctic (JARPAII) includes 50 Fin whales (Endangered ESA & IUCN) and 50 Humpback whales (Endangered ESA & vulnerable IUCN) and of course hundreds upon hundreds of Minke whales (“The cockroaches of the sea” said a Japanese official).

      Even though they have a special permit for 50 Humpbacks, they seem to be leaving these alone (although this may be hard to prove) for the purposes of political bargaining.

      The Japanese Whale Research Program under Special Permit in the North Pacific (JARPNII) deserves a special mention here because it is the hunt that is not as well known as JARPAII. The North Pacific hunt consists of a much larger variety of endangered whales. They include:

      - Sei
      - Bryde’s
      - Sperm

      Along with a large haul of “common minke” whales.

      So it really does look like important science is being undertaken (NOT) when they are plucking endangered whales out of the oceans – the same whales struggling to get back to pre-whaling industry numbers which face even more challenges these days due to pollution, shipping ( & ship strikes), sonar tests (noise pollution, some of which can be lethal), loss of breeding grounds, climate change and loss of food sources (humans taking krill now too). And lastly, these science expeditions seemingly keep increasing their quotas of “samples needed” as Japan is longing for the day when they can begin full commerical whaling and until that day, they will continue to commercially whale under JARPAII and JARPNII.

  • romika3

    Folks, I am surprized you havn’t figured it out yet. The SSCS folks have been lead away on a chase for weeks now, while the Japanese harvest their quota for the year. However, the chase does provide plenty of opportunty to film next seasons “Whale Wars” and that is the most important of Wastson and his troupe of actors.

    • David

      All of this is just a possibility and is not based on any direct facts, but-

      Isn’t it possible that the Yushin Marus the SSCS has been playing with are just a diversion and the Sun Laurel was just to supply them, while the Nisshin Maru with another group of harpoon ships and their own supply ship are in a totally different area of the Antarctic whaling with no interference?

      Consider;

      - the SSCS has not had a single contact with the Nisshin Maru, not visual, not by radar and not even from the helicopter
      - the ICR knew the general area where the SSCS was waiting for them, and then expanded this years hunting area just before contact, so it would have been easy to send decoys right into the SSCS ‘trap’
      - for most of the time since contact the Yushins have been the followers not the followed, why wouldn’t at least one of them have left to go hunting, we haven’t even heard about one trying to depart and the SSCS following it
      - the ICR has been very quiet, only minimal comments usually after the SSCS reports on actions against the Yushins, maybe they realize that antagonizing Paul by claiming to still be hunting and reporting their kill totals would just cause the SSCS to start searching again, so by being quiet the Nisshin Maru can do whatever it wants wherever it wants

      As far as the upcoming Whale Wars season it looks pretty bleak. There have been one or two minor incidents, some launching of balloons and a lot of ships following each other around while burning large amounts of fuel. I expect that when the Steve Irwin leaves port after its upcoming visit that unless the Nisshin Maru has been spotted the SSCS will start taking some direct action against the Yushins and possibly the Sun Laurel to get some good footage. Otherwise the upcoming season will be very boring or only about 3 episodes long.

    • AnimuX

      The hopes of pro-whaling antagonists will not be realized this year (as usual).

      Sea Shepherd has successfully removed two of the three harpoon ships from the hunt just with their presence in the Southern Ocean. As SSCS intercepted these ships at the very start of the whaling season (which began late this season) one can safely assume Japan’s hunt will fall short of its quota again.

      Now it appears the activists have separated the whaling fleet from its fuel re-supply vessel as well. With the fuel capacity of the Bob Barker and the ability to conserve fuel by blockading the slow tanker ship, Sea Shepherd will also be able to maintain an uninterrupted presence during this campaign.

      Multiple wiki-leaks and statements of Japanese fisheries officials recently confirmed the obvious. Sea Shepherd has made a measurable impact by forcing a large reduction in the number of whales killed annually and increasing political pressure on Japan’s government over whaling. SSCS activists are closer than ever to achieving their ultimate goal: to stop the Japanese whaling fleet from continuing the slaughter of whales that are protected by international conventions.

      • boo radley

        *As far as the upcoming Whale Wars season it looks pretty bleak. There have been one or two minor incidents, some launching of balloons and a lot of ships following each other around while burning large amounts of fuel*

        Interesting post…and more than a little funny… Paul Watson and SSCS are damned if they do and damned if they don’t.

        If they don’t, then they are useless, Paul Watson is a fat lazy pig and its a boring season of whale wars.

        If they do then its “violence” and “eco terrorism” and “they must be stopped”.

      • David

        No they are damned either way. It is just as illegal whether it actually protects any whales or not and whether it makes good TV or not.

      • boo radley

        Well anyway, it looks as though DO has won the day.
        The Nisshin Maru has been found and thats the end of that little research program.

        So now according to the whalers, Paul Watson will be useless and everything that the SSCS crew do will be illegal and or amoral from now on.

      • David

        I hate repeating myself but since you didn’t understand the first time I guess I will.

        No Paul was just as useless and many of the things the SSCS did were illegal before they found the Nisshin Maru and will continue to be useless and illegal now that they have found the Nisshin Maru.

        Also I doubt the Japanese plan on letting last years actions be repeated this year. Just like they suckered the SSCS for almost a month, I expect they have a plan to deal with the current situation.

  • http://www.fileaway.com D.Tilink

    As someone who has slept in rooms with Watson and heard many conversations about the time above, I can confirm Watson is a liar and is so full of himself but also in denial of it (might have something to do with his old age), An ego so big I’m sure the Japanese will see him coming from Canada. His releasing such information because he wants you to think his the good guy because he told you first, he thinks your all a bunch of idiots, well his wrong about that. I do not believe SS save whales, I do believe they are good at saying they do and convincing you otherwise whilst taking your cash to do so and I blame this on the leadership that makes up SS. I also sat and watched Paul eat many different types of animals and tell me he thinks most of them should be killed. King Neptune of the sea eh? I think not.

    • http://www.facebook.com/people/David-Enrique-Duprat/7013512 David Enrique Duprat

      D, I wish there were more people like you who know who Paul Watson really is and that would come forward and voice it. The world needs to know who he really is and the poison that it is to get involved with that man.

    • Michael Raymer

      You almost had me…up until that last part. Then your credibility got strapped to a runaway bobsled to hell. Now you make it obvious that you’ve never been within a hundred miles of Watson. Nice try.

      I don’t know why I’m replying. I’m sure this is just another one-timer. Comes in here, takes his cheap shot and is never heard from again.

  • oceanlover

    Take a listen to the interview with Paul Watson at the end of this post. It’s from the early days of his split from Greenpeace. It’s very interesting what he has to say about when “the organization becomes more important then the issue.”

    http://sharkdivers.blogspot.com/2010/10/sea-shepherd-watson-fiddling-around.html

    • Michael Raymer

      Dude, you can’t swing a dead cat….ermm, I mean dead carrot around here without hitting that link. We’ve all seen it, we’ve all heard it, we’re all completely over it.

      • boo radley

        oh good one romika3, another one from 1973…

  • Michael Raymer

    LATEST UPDATE:

    http://www.seashepherd.org/news-and-media/news-110125-1.html

    “After a 26-day pursuit covering over 4,000 miles, the Steve Irwin caught up with the Nisshin Maru at 1800 hours on January 25th, 2011 AEST.”

    “On January 23rd, Captain Watson made a risky decision to call off the Bob Barker from continuing the pursuit of the Sun Laurel. His concern was that the Nisshin Maru with two harpoon vessels could begin whaling operations in the Ross Sea within days.

    The Bob Barker was instructed to head due south as a decoy to lead the Yushin Maru along while the Steve Irwin entered the Ross Sea.

    And today after a 26-day pursuit, the Nisshin Maru has finally been caught and the Steve Irwin is on its tail. The Bob Barker some 300 miles away has been instructed to join the Steve Irwin.”

    “Unfortunately, the Japanese whaling fleet appears to have just begun their illegal whaling operations. There is a whale presently being butchered on the deck. Sea Shepherd’s objective now is to make sure that whale is the last one taken this season.”

    That’s just excerpts from the main article. More details if you click on the link.

    I just popped my first beer in 2 weeks and am breathing a lot easier now. Optimism is rising to previous levels.

    • boo radley

      Well its really game over now for the whalers.

  • Pingback: Sea Shepherd's Paul Watson on Ady Gil and Pete Bethune | ecorazzi.com :: the latest in green gossip

  • http://www.naturalvetcompany.com Vivienne

    you know this page is sad – sad becuase Paul Watson obviously thinks whales and dolphins are more important than most things in life. Sad because so does Ady. And perhaps Pete and definately Michael.

    Respecting each other in the fight against what is happening in the oceans today is vital for any of these campaigns to succeed.

    Keep the fighting offline and directing focus to what is happening is the only way forward

    I have heard Paul is not going to comment again – good – someone needs to put a stop to this damaging dialogue. Noone should exult that by whales being killed, one party is being belittled. None of us want them to be killed, we all want the whales/dolphins in our future and that is what we need to remember

  • thescotsman

    paul watson has been saving the oceans long before i was born, he is a legend for actavists and rightly so. the good auld admiral does the best he can with what he’s got. i dont really know much about ady gill but it is my belief that anyone donating a boat to the sscs should prepare for the worse.

    There is too much speculation that the whalers havent killed many whales or that they have been given a free run with one harpoon ship all season. either way the only people that can put this to rest is the ICR. The refuelling ship may well be a decoy, in my opinion it is very small and couldnt possibly hold enough suppliesfor four ships. if this was the ONLY refuelling ship then i will be a happy jock.

    The way i see it is there are far too many anti whalers out there slagging off the admiral. he has single handedly saved more animals than all of yous. if you are sincere and genuine about wanting to save wild animals from mass slaughter, you have to applaud watsons results. i am forever in his debt as he pursues something i feel strongley about and gets results. i also fully back pete and ady. You have to applaud them for everything they have done and sacraficed for our oceans. The oceans are a vital asset of earth and need protecting,

    the japanese say that its part of thier culture, that may well be true however the planethas never been in such a critical condition as it is now and its time for change. fox hunting was part of the uk culture. whaling was part of australias culture. canada stopped supplying cod. the list is endless. you do not need to eat whales to survive.

  • tallyho

    I MAY be a one timer on the site (maybe not), but I like to read and generally lurk. Michael, keep your posts up; they are thought provoking and your posts are very much appreciated. Cristal, you have a good point but frankly, why are so many folks disturbed by Paul Watson the person vs. Adm. Watson (in command of a small fleet). He is just a man on a mission. He asks no pardon from his detractors.

    The he says/she says nonsense is nuts. Gossip and rumours, as a general rule, should be ignored rather than being passed around more often than a basketball.

    I am skeptical of any venom spewed by the posters who say they have personally sailed with SS. WOW! If you don’t like the man, no one is going ram sticks up your fingernails to try to change your MIND *ahem*. Fine, support Ady and Pete in their new ocean wildlife-saving mission. Bad mouthing and whining aside, well, that is the thought for the day… set your bad mouthing and whining aside.

    “The world needs to know who he really is and the poison that it is to get involved with that man.” REALLY?? Hey, there are those in this world who would make a pact with the unholiest of the unholy if they could get the slaughter of whales, dolphins, tuna, baby seals and any other violent, unnecessary and vicious mass murder of mammals stopped.

  • http://N/A John Kaza

    So the final score:

    Sea Shepherd ONE (won?)

    Japanese whale poachers and losers on this forum: ZERO

  • http://www.facebook.com/arief.triantoko Arief Triantoko

    I am skeptical of any venom spewed by the posters who say they have personally sailed with SS. WOW! If you don’t like the man, no one is going ram sticks up your fingernails to try to change your MIND *ahem*. Fine, support Ady and Pete in their new ocean wildlife-saving mission. Bad mouthing and whining aside, well, that is the thought for the day… set your bad mouthing and whining aside.